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08-14-2010, 04:56 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 90
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Question on veins post-chemo
I have "challenging veins" since chemo (20 infusions, the usual MUGAs, etc, no port). It's been 4 years and it still takes most MDs and RNs several tries to get a good IV. I wonder if there's something I can do to get my veins back to normal?
I had Sentinel Node Biopsy and I think only 3 lymph nodes removed. Does anyone have experience with using veins in the Sentinel Node arm? So far all my docs say to avoid using that arm, but I don't know if that's based on old information when most people had many nodes removed. Last week my doc had to try 6 times to get a vein that worked. I was sure ready to switch arms. I look like a junkie, with all the bruises!
I've been taken twice by ambulance to the ER (over 4 years) and don't know how important it is to make sure I gather my wits and tell them to use the non-Sentinel Node arm.
I'd appreciate hearing what you know. Thanks.
__________________
Carol
Lyons, CO
dx June '05 at age 55
Stage 1, 1.5cm
ER+++, PR--, HER2+++
Lumpectomy, A/C, T/H
Herceptin stopped due to low LVEF (35%)
2010: NED, but continuing major chemo brain injury
www.BeyondChemoBrain.com
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08-14-2010, 07:29 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 3,154
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Re: Question on veins post-chemo
Hi Carol,
From what I recently was advised (as I have small veins) and it is a real job for the nurse when drawing blood. They do not use the arm of the surgery side. Like you I did not have a port during chem treatment and had SN biopsey. I know that it is important to keep hydrated which helps the veins and my nurse always uses a butterfly needle.
Jean
__________________
Stage 1, Grade 1, 3/30/05
Lumpectomy 4/15/05 - 6MM IDC
Node Neg. (Sentinel node)
ER+ 90% / PR-, Her2+++ by FISH
Ki-67 40%
Arimidex 5/05
Radiation 32 trt, 5/30/05
Oncotype DX test 4/17/06, 31% high risk
TOPO 11 neg. 4/06
Stopped Arimidex 5/06
TCH 5/06, 6 treatments
Herceptin 5/06 - for 1 yr.
9/06 Completed chemo
Started Femara Sept. 2006
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08-14-2010, 08:03 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,210
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Re: Question on veins post-chemo
Carol, I don't really have an answer for you. Jean's advice about having them use a butterfly is good. I had sentinal nodes done on both sides but my left had some lymphedema issues so that is the one we do not ever use. Do you wear a medic alert bracelt on that wrist? Not that it always helps. I was wearing one during my recent hospitalization, there were big signs all over saying "no needles, left arm" and STILL, I woke up once from a drugged state to see that someone had started an IV in that arm while I was not aware.
__________________
Bonnie
Post menopause
May 2007 Core biopsy, Rt breast
ER+, Pr-, HER2 +++, Grade 3
Ki-67: 90%
"suspicious area" left breast
Bilateral mastectomy, (NED on left) May 2007
Sentinel Node Neg
Stage 1, DCIS with microinvasion, 3 mm, mostly removed during the biopsy....
Femara (discontinued 7/07) Resumed 10/07
OncoType score 36 (July 07)
Began THC 7/26/07 (d/c taxol and carboplatin 10/07)
Began Herceptin alone 10/07
Finished Herceptin July /08
D/C Femara 4/10 (joint pain/trigger thumb!)
5/10 mistakenly dx with lung cancer. Middle rt lobe removed!
Aromasin started 5/10
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08-14-2010, 09:00 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 3,142
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Re: Question on veins post-chemo
Have you tried wrapping the arm you want to use for the I. V. in a warm cloth, several warm cloths, warm towels, a heavy jacket, or even a blanket before the infusions to warm it up? Warmed up veins respond better to needles.
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08-15-2010, 12:54 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 858
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Re: Question on veins post-chemo
Hi Carol. I have to report the same problem although I had a port. Since chemo, it is very very difficult to find my veins in my only available arm. It wasn't the case before. They told me it might improve over time but now almost 4 years have passed. They once used my foot. Some nurses however seem to manage better than others. As for Jean, they sometimes use a butterfly needle. I am happy you posted this question. Maybe we will receive other explanations and suggestions. I always wondered about the veins in the rest of my body. What are the potential consequences. Michka
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08.2006 3 cm IDC Stage 2-3, HER2 3+ ER+90% PR 20%
FEC, Taxol+ Herceptin, Mastectomy, Radiation, Herceptin 1 year followed by Tykerb 1 year,Aromasin /Faslodex
12.2010 Mets to liver,Herceptin+Tykerb
03.2011 Liver resection ER+70% PR-
04.2011 Herceptin+Navelbine+750mg Tykerb
06.2011 Liver ned, Met to sternum. Added Zometa 09.2011 Cyberknife for sternum
11.2011 Pet clear. Stop Navelbine, continuing on Hercpetin+Tykerb+Aromasin
02.2012 Mets to lungs, nodes, liver
04.2012 TDM1, Ned in 07.2012
04.2015 Stop TDM1/Kadcyla, still Ned, liver problems
04.2016 Liver mets. Back on Kadcyla
08.2016 Kadcyla stopped working. mets to liver lungs bones
09.2016 Biopsy to liver. no more HER2, still ER+
09.2016 CMF Afinitor/Aromasin/ Xgeva.Met to eye muscle Cyberknife
01.2017 Gemzar/Carboplatin/ Ibrance/Faslodex then Taxotere
02.2017 30 micro mets to brain breathing getting worse and worse
04.2017 Liquid biopsy/CTC indicates HER2 again. Start Herceptin with Halaven
06.2017 all tumors shrunk 60% . more micro mets to brain (1mm mets) no symptoms
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08-15-2010, 01:27 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Melbourne Victoria
Australia
Posts: 330
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Re: Question on veins post-chemo
Hi
I use my arm that I had lymph nodes out for blood tests and herceptin and have done so for 4 years without any problems. Chemo I have in the other arm.
Cheers
Jackie (down under)
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08-15-2010, 09:15 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 90
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Re: Question on veins post-chemo
Re: Question on veins post-chemo
Thanks, friends, for the comments! Yes, ever since the later chemo days I have used the hotpacks, hydrate, etc. And always the butterfly to help hold the needle. The problem seems to be that my veins have a lot of tough scar tissue (from the drugs, I assume). The chemo nurses used up all the good veins! The only ones left are "rollers" or too small.
This summer I have been trying IV glutathione (a powerful antioxidant that doesn't survive the digestive tract) to see if it helps the chemo brain. It does, but so far I'm not sure if it's a long-term solution. With the tiny needles that fit into my non-chemo-scarred veins, a drip takes a long time!
So Jackie - did anyone ever officially tell you it's fine to use the other arm? That does seem like the solution to me, if it's ok. Good to hear it works for you!
If anyone finds an article on the subject, or has a MD's opinion, I'd love to hear it. Thank you!
__________________
Carol
Lyons, CO
dx June '05 at age 55
Stage 1, 1.5cm
ER+++, PR--, HER2+++
Lumpectomy, A/C, T/H
Herceptin stopped due to low LVEF (35%)
2010: NED, but continuing major chemo brain injury
www.BeyondChemoBrain.com
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