anyone had this--start of bone mets?

[michele u]

I have been having alot of back pain. I did before cancer but this is different. Right in the spine between my shoulder blades and i feel this pain inside somewhere. I tried to have someone push on my spine, they say it really hurts if you have mets. Also i have been waking up at night with severe pains in my hands esp in the joints. Some of this could be from the vaccine causing auto immune symptoms. My legs have also been going numb, esp at night. Paranoid? Maybe. But had a terrible headache yesterday, never have headaches. I'm hoping its nothing, but is this what boney mets feels like?

[Lolly]

Dear Michele, I don't know what bone mets feels like, but I would certainly talk to your onc and ask for scans if you're worried, as that's the only way to know for sure.

I've had the vaccine also, and I've been having those same wrist pains at night, plus lots of lower back pain but I'm also on chemo again and have been getting Neulasta and Arenesp which cause lots of aches and pains.

I'm concerned for you about the headache and the legs going numb. This is a worry, so you must get things checked out!

<3 Lolly

[Gina]

find out where your CA 27/29 and your Serum Her-2 levels are...I have had bone mets only in one area, the sternum, but when it is active, it hurts like heck--especially when you press on it--and swells up and shoots pains down both arms to where I can hardly dress or drive until I get it back under control..and I have worked with folks with bone mets who are in such pain and agony that they can hardly stand to move an inch. Bone mets are usually extremely painful..especially anywhere along the spine as that is where so many nerve endings are...go into your onc and get a bone scan from head to toe and CT of Chest, Ab and pelvis WITH contrast and WITHOUT or, if your onc follows you by Pet scan, schedule one...I am going to have my very first Pet scan --just for fun--in mid - December...so far, I have been followed very successfully for so many years by CT but wanted to try the Pet scan to see if I could locate any other areas of disease besides the sternum, just to be on the safe side. I have MRI's on occasion just as a precaution, but rarely, if ever, do I have headaches. Sometimes, if the headache is in your right temple..., it is a sign that your Red Blood Cells have fallen below 4.0. In this case, all you need to do is eat some protein - rich food and go to sleep and build them back up--and the headache should ease up by morning... Concord grape juice, Beets, beet juice and raisins will also bring the red blood cells back up and ease the headache away. If you want to get rid of this dull, NAGGING, ache quickly, just go to the store and buy ONE GRANNY SMITH apple...has to be GRANNY SMITH...come home, cut it in half, hold one half up to your nose and breath in the enzymes...will stop the pain instantly until you can build up the RED Blood cells. If your red cells are fine, ask for an MRI, STAT.

However, a lot of times pain somewhere in the back is referred pain...especially if it is higher and in - between the shoulder blades..most commonly in her-2 folks this is a symptom of liver mets. I used to have this pain non-stop whenever my liver would fill back up with lesions and then it would just fade away as the herceptin cleared the liver again and again. If you can take your right hand and fold it straight back to the area just below the neck and slightly to the right side of the spine..and touch the area where you are in pain...this is probably referred pain from mets in the right lobe of the liver. If the pain is on the other side, LEFT hand folded back to where you can pat yourself on the back to the left of your spine, this is referred pain from either the left lobe of the liver or worse, pancreas...fyi. From what I have witnessed first hand with one patient and from what I have read, pancreatic cancer pain is HORRIBLE--one of the worst, sometimes the nerve even has to be severed to provide some limited relief as even narcatics can not touch full-blown pancreatic pain.

As for the hands going numb thing, ease up on ginger, tumeric, cumin, cayenne, and garlic for a few days, should you be taking any of these as supplements or eating things rich in these spices...and see if the numbness resolves...be sure you are walking daily to keep all the blood and lymph circulating, if you are able to do so. When I had liver mets on several occasions...I had pain in my wrists similar to what you describe and considerable numbness in my hands--usually at night, most noticeable on waking up..it would be like my hands were still "asleep"..my onc told me it was carpal tunnel and gave me splits..hee hee hee...Fortunately, when the liver lesions were resolved ON ALL OCCASIONS by the Herceptin, all these pains went away, and I guess you ALL can tell from how much and how fast I type, that I never did have any TRACE of CARPAL tunnel then and I certainly don't have any now.....chuckle chuckle....Oncs are just so funny, they brighten my day.... :-)

Also, keep in mind that when your body makes lots of immune cells all at once or even red blood cells, this can be very painful--aka think NEULASTA SHOT--...these pains are more like moving pains..especially in the long bones of the arms and the legs. If you press on them, they do not hurt, just disappear only to reappear somewhere else. They are especially troubling when you try to sleep as the pain keeps circulating through out your whole body and it is difficult to find any comfortable position...of course, for you brave folks taking herceptin with out the pre-meds..., you are probably experiencing lots of these moving pains the night of your herceptin infusion, but usually, they pass within 24 to 36 hours of the infusion. If you want to make them pass quicker, walk around a good bit immediately following the herceptin infusion to push it to every corner of your bio-chemistry and the bouts of moving pains, if any, will be shortened, uh, if not sweetened...sorry just try to take consolation in the fact that these moving pains often indicate a very positive response to the Herceptin, especially when occupanied by a slight fever that may hang on for a few hours, or at least this has been my experience as well as that of many folks taking Herceptin that I have known, FYI, Gina Popp

[al from Canada]

Lolly,
I remember reading that EPO increased tumorgenis however, after looking it up it seems to be OK. More information for everyone.
Al
http://www.fdaadvisorycommittee.com/...4_AranespP.htm

Michelle,

My onc and others have said that painkillers won't really work on mets. have you taken anything? Any response? I hope you can get this resolved quickly. I KNOW how scary this is!!!!

Take care,

Olivia

[Esther]

Michelle, when I was first diagnosed with bone mets, I heard that bone mets rarely is found in joints

My oncologist told me to follow up on any pain that lasts longer than a week. I hope that yours turns out to be nothing but side effects from the vaccines, and dissipate quickly!

Gina,

You are such a treasure! Everytime I read your posts, I feel better.

Karen

[mts]

Michelle,
I posted the exact symptoms a week or so before you posted yours. After some responses from this board coming back with "possible bone mets" -I immediately scheduled tests (my doc is good about letting me have what I want). I still have the weird pain (only when I inhale deep). I had a chest X-Ray (nothing!) and I had a CT (nothing, again!) I am scheduled for a PET this Friday. The onc feels that the problem is muskulo-skeletal. I will know Friday if the CT missed anything.
Its not my chest wall- that pain would be closer to the front of the body (not the back). Anyway, I was wondering if you have had any scans... perhaps that would ease your mind.

Maria

[Lyn]

Hi Gina, I am having the same problems with my right arm, neck and shoulder, and as you say when you put your right arm over your shoulder my pain is there but I have also got muscle wastage and I cannot lift my right arm I have no strength in the lift motion. I have been to physio and she contacted my onc and he has asked for a MRI and I am waiting for the paper work, he told her he was thinking the big C, I hate to say the full word, but it has only escalated since I refractured my left shoulder and when my shoulders are strapped up with a figure 8 sling like wearing a backback, it seems to remove some of the pressure and I don't need as much pain relief, I am hoping that it is just nerve damage from my Trigiminal Neuralgia or Radiation but I wish I could find one doc who KNEW EVERYTHING!!!! I am so complicated and the first thing that comes to their mind is the dirty "C" word, I had an MRI in April of the head, neck and shoulder and no sign of anything, plus a bone scan which only showed up my wrecked shoulders, I am getting paranoid and keep looking to see if I am turning yellow and the other thing is if you have liver problems my dad always said your breath would be sweet smelling, so I am glad when my tactless daughter tells me my breath is off, I just say GOOD, give me a peppermint. So I too am in limbo until I have tests done and being so close to Xmas it will be hard to get and see anyone, I haven't been too worried because last Xmas I had all my tests done and I was NED over the holidays and in the second week of January, IT WAS BAAAACK! I am changing the name of my diseases, yes lumping them all together and naming it CANCERBETIES, the same family as diabeties and I will just have to keep treating the symptoms, interesting thing is I don't have diabeties YET?*!



Love & Hugs Lyn