Younger, more aggressive? Part Deux

[kcherub]

Okay, I brought up the line I said about it upsetting me that the general rule for younger women with breast cancer is that they "have more aggressive" disease, and thus a poorer prognosis. When I read this shortly after my diagnosis, I felt so hopeless. I tried and tried to find a concrete answer as to "why". Really, most times is just says that and nothing else.

Here is what he said and what I have found a little bit of online: Most younger women tend to have triple negative breast cancers.

As we all know, with tamoxifen and Herceptin, there are targeted therapies, plus chemo (although the jury is still out on it's true effectiveness with ER+). This is what I thought from the get-go, but it was nice to hear it from him. He "rocks", so I trust him. He seems to be a bit of a research-hound, himself.

Being T1, N0, M0 at diagnosis, I felt like I was lucky to have found it that early. Until I read that line. Not that those who are higher on that lovely scale we have all come to know by heart, are "worse" off, especially with Herceptin on our side! Like I always say, there is no prize for Stage 1 breast cancer.

Anyhoo, wouldn't it be nice if younger women weren't just tagged like this? By younger, they set that upon all women under 40 at diagnosis. There are a lot of us here!

Off my soapbox now. :)

Take care,

[Joanne S]

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_1_3.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxmk788MNUS)
It is not really an age thing. It actually a hormone thing.

When cancer is hormone positive:
(Older) Post-menopausal women produce less hormones than younger women.
(Younger) women having periods produce more hormones than post-menopausal women, so the risk for younger women is considered higher. :)

I have also read that hormone negative women are at higher risk than hormone positive because there are many unknowns as to what is causing the cancer to grow. And hormone positive cancers have more drugs available.

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_1_48.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxmk788MNUS)

Jo

[Lani]

confounded by lumping a lot of different diseases with different risk factors,prognoses and affecting different ethnic groups/those with different genetic predispositions into one.

It is like saying all dogs are hyperactive. It depends on their diet, activity, breed, blood-line, early environment, current environment, age, etc.

Well, triple negative breast cancer, which makes up a small minority of breast cancer is more common in younger than older patients and that can skew the results when making generalizations like this.

Triple positive bc is more common in the elderly, which is probably the source of the generalization that their bcs tend to be less agressive.

No matter what statistics are touted, all that matters is what you have!

And all you can do is try to keep informed and do what YOU think best (and try to get your doctor to help you along the way)

[kcherub]

Thanks, ladies! I know that cancer at any age is just unfair, but it would be better for ALL women to break it down by their own prognostics, you know?

Have a great night!

[Joanne S]

Okay, I brought up the line I said about it upsetting me that the general rule for younger women with breast cancer is that they "have more aggressive" disease, and thus a poorer prognosis. When I read this shortly after my diagnosis, I felt so hopeless. I tried and tried to find a concrete answer as to "why". Really, most times is just says that and nothing else. I tried and tried to find a concrete answer as to "why". Really, most times is just says that and nothing else.

Krista, You are welcome. Based on the characterics listed with your signature, you have a great prognosis. You need not worry or feel hopeless.

No one really can guarantee or predict prognosis. You never know, someone could get bitten by one of those hyperactive dogs tomorrow and get an ear ache or somethin' http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_1_214.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxmk788MNUS)! heheee !

It's obvious all of of us have many different BC characteristics, some known characteristics (ie, hormone receptor status) and so many unknown (i.e., genes, toxic ingestion/exposure, internal chemical or system trigger combinations...) and we all know that everyone's situation is unique. Even those that don't share their personal BC info.

Continued wellness wishes,
Joanne

[Lani]

i was responding to kcherub, not to your post.

Sorry if you didn't understand...I will just assume I am at fault for not communicating well.

"or why she even bothered to post"--I posted for kcherub whose worry I sensed and whose concern I was trying to allay with information.

Sorry it was missed on you. Again, I will just chalk it up to not being able to
communicate my point well enough for it to be universally understood.

No offence was intended to dogs...perhaps I should have picked another less popular animal!

[Joanne S]

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_2_7.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxmk788MNUS) Lani,

Not to worry!

I apologize I accidentially hit save and it posted before I had my thoughts together so I edited the post.

I misinterpretted again.
Sorry, Jo http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_2_8.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxmk788MNUS)
:)

[Marlys]

As many of you know, I am a retired O.R. nurse. I always said that if I made it past 40 I would not fret about getting breast cancer. That is because in my practice I saw so often that the younger ladies did not have a good prognosis. I was at the beauty shop when my PCP called with the results of my needle biopsy. I shed a few tears and then remembered my feeling about age. I was 66 so I was way past the "fatal" age. However, I am better educated now. Experience is the best teacher, after all. I had my second lumpectomy (for wider margins) on April 25, 2005. That is the day that ASCO released the news about Herceptin. I was so excited because I qualified. However my onc was not sure about it. But by the time I finished AC he was all for me getting this "miracle" drug. I do know that I would still be almost as concerned as those of you who are younger if I had been under 40. But I love to believe that those of us who are her2 + are still way ahead of the pack. Since I joined this "sorority" of ours we have lost a few "sisters" and I have cried for this loss but then I remember how many of us are making it every day and am so grateful for each day that we all have.
I don't know why I have felt the need to ramble on like this but I do love this site and my sisters here.
Love & hugs,
Marlys

[MJo]

Cherub -- Joanne said it right. You young ones still produce mucho hormones. We post-menopausal women have less -- ahem -- "juice." So calm down. I agree you were lucky to find the tumor early. Me too. With good treatment, I trust we will both enjoy many years. I think we survivors know that "enjoy" is a very important word.

[kcherub]

I was just sitting here, and decided to go on Adjuvant! Online and put in my "stats", but using ER- this time, instead of +. My overall survival (10 year) was 2% less. However, the recurrence rate was about 10% lower with ER-. That flows with what I thought originally, that we have more time (and estrogen) to recurr. I love it when I do a little research on my own, and find that my "inklings" were valid to a certain degree.

Now, that's not really great news, as the recurrence posibility (using A!O) was my main deciding factor with regard to chemo. I wonder, if there is nothing specifically targeted towards ER-, would that have less a chance of recurring? I suppose it is the fact that most BC patients are women and have estrogen floating around, and A!O adds 1.5% hazard for women under 34. I know that sounds simple and very obvious, but I just like to type something out. LOL

That being said, if I was 6 weeks from my 35th birthday, do I have to be 34 on A!O. Hahahaha.

Take care,

[kcherub]

Oh, and BTW, I go on A!O about 5 times a day to see if 9.0 (with Herceptin added) is up yet. :)

[Joanne S]

Marlys,

Very nice post! Thanks for sharing!

Hugs,
Jo

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And Krista,
Stay off of that site ! ! !