Anyone else accused of lack of faith for fighting cancer?

[Kimberly Lewis]

I just had to respond to someone I love who asked me where my faith was because I consider vigilance a part of life now... here is my response - anyone with this as an issue or have any opinions on how to deal better with it? Thanks, Kim

I understand that my "attitude" of realism re:the disease can be misconstrued as a lack of faith. When you say to me that I have done everything I can I am taken aback. I feel that I have invested hours of time in treatments, many thousands of dollars of medications, and now it is up to me to be vigilant about watching for recurrence so that my possibility of surviving the next onslaught is better. I believe that God will take care of me but I don't neglect maintenance of my car and wait for the motor to seize up from lack of oil. cont.........

[Kimberly Lewis]

I am depressed - but I am seeking to have some counseling from a trained person in order to see how I can deal with it - not just swallow some pill and smooth over the emotional issues that may be the root of the depression. (though chemical issues are very real also!)

I don't understand the attitude within the medical field that expects people to go merrily on their way after cancer treatment. The facts as I understand them are that metastasis are more easily defeated when caught early. If you wait for a brain tumor to present itself with major symptoms you are dead already. If you find small tumors on an MRI you can treat with the next stage of chemo and gamma knife surgery and possibly have them disappear! Much more positive result in any normal persons eyes. So why do we expect a rational person to sit around "living life to its fullest?" I do life a full life - I kayak, see friends, participate in art groups, board meetings, gallery events, sustain a home and husband, spend time with family whenever possible. But part of that full life is doing what I can to survive to see my grandchildren grow up. Part of that means staying up with the latest developments in cancer research. Seeing what is out there in clinical trials, recent drugs being tested, how effective they are... The drug I am on right now that is the latest greatest hope in BC treatment was only approved for use in non-metastatic use the very year I got it! (if that isn't a sign that God didn't intend for me to die from this - what is?) They still don't know how long they should even be giving it. Speculation runs from 9 weeks to indefinitely! Take into account that they don't even know if this is effective for me - 50% chance that it is though so here I am, treating every 3 weeks for 2 years, the most aggressive treatment around for my stage. That is faith in my book... as it just might kill me too!

[Kimberly Lewis]

I love my family and my life but once this disease is beyond reasonable treatment I will go happily to a Father who loves me, without fear or doubt that I will be turned away. It is that simple faith that sustains me and holds me through my darker moods, and helps me to know that suffering is a part of life that teaches us things we would never know in the superficial plane we normally exist in. I appreciate the prayers I receive and believe that they do me good. I am having the most positive attitude that I can - but closing my eyes and folding my hands is not the only thing I can do. The apostle Paul said - let him who will not work - not eat as well... (2Thess. 3:10) we are expected as far as I understand it - to work. Positive results from positive action - mixed with faith and hope and Love. This is the scripture in a nutshell to me right now.

[VirginiaGirl]

Dear Kim, Your reply was right on the nose! I'm sorry you had to deal with that. After my initial diagnosis I was asked if I was ready to meet my maker, it stunned me, though I know there was no malicious intent there. I also know that I'm more inclined lately to over-react to things because my head is not where everyone else's is a lot of the time. So, consider the person's intent, and don't let it get you down! Information is power.

If there's anything that cancer has taught me it is the truth of the expression "God helps those who help themselves." I quickly realized that God would take care of me according to his plan, but he wasn't going to pick up the phone and argue with the insurance company - that part was my job. It is overwhelming the amount of time it takes to research all the info, just reading all the info in these forums can be overwhelming! Thank God, too, there are those of you out there who are able to sort through it and share it with the rest of us! If this disease finally does get me, I want to be able to tell myself and my family that I did do absolutely everything I could, at least the second time around!
Peace

[Becky]

God bless you Kimberly. You have said many things that hit the nail on the head, over and over again. I have tears in my eyes over it. Your quote from Paul was excellent. I had forgotten about it and Paul in general (who is the most realistic apostle). I will have to read him. He is very "get up and get out there".


Many of my friends also say " its gone and you're cured". Well, we all sure hope so and "statistically" many of us are but you have to live it to understand and and today, I sure do understand everything you have said.

Take care dear friend and have a wonderful Thanksgiving.

[CLTann]

You are right on the bull's eye in correcting others' remark about putting yourself in His hand. If there is even a trace of validity of relying only on one's faith, there is no need for medical profession at all. It is too simplistic to say that God will take care of everything. Snap back at those who made these remarks, asking whether they ever needed any medication at all. I knew some sect of religious fanatic refuses to accept any medical treatment. I watch the woman died so unnecessarily from an illness easily curable by modern medicine. The world is full of lunatics whom we should carefully stay away.

Ann

[karenann]

God bless you Kimberly. I think your reply is perfect.

My experience has been that people who have not walked in our shoes don't understand. A lot of people in my life think now that my treatment is over, I should just go forward and I am, with caution. When they ask how I am doing, I say fine, because that is what they want to hear.

I am still involved with several of the women from my support group and they always want to hear how I am doing. We share our fears and talk about the aches and pains we have. Somehow, eventhough we don't see each other as often as we would like, this connection really helps.

I would recommend this type of group to any cancer survivor.

I hope you and all of the women on this board have a peaceful and happy Thanksgiving.

Hugs,

Karen

[Cathy1]

Hi Kimberly

"Work as if everything depended on you and pray as if everything depended on God." Never mind what anyone says. You only have to answer to the one Just Judge and He loves you as if you were the only one. God Bless, Cathy1

[Sandy H]

You are so right in saying they don't understand because they have not walked in our shoes. After almost 6 years of being in and out of treatment I am still asked when I am going back to work! They tell me I look great. They don't understand the chemo brain, fatique, sleepless nights, all the appointments we sat around for, the phone calls to straighten out the errors of billing, trying to eat healthy and not on the run, drink lots of fluids causing us to go to the bathroom more frequently and on and on it goes. Enough said, Kim you said it well, keep the faith and keep moving on. You have God's leading and will do well. Have a blessed, happy Thanksgiving. hugs, Sandy

[Bev]

Hope things look better tomorrow. I haven't had the lack of faith reply but the good attitude reply. I do have a good attitude but I don't think that my Her-2 proteins really care or are affected by my attitude.

I think the oncs expect us to be happy because statistically our chances are somewhat small to get brain mets, although 3X higher than other BC I think, still small. It's less likely for you to have brain mets than not. Of course most of us had tiny odds of getting BC in the first place. So the oncs do have the right perspective which is easier to have when you don't have BC.

Do the counselling. If it doesn't help maybe the meds will. I think some psych problems are chemically based and counselling your seratonin uptake won't work.

All of us have these kind of days. You will have really good days again. Bev

[CherylS]

Kim,

I am so thrilled to see your resolve in this post. I am sorry that you had to even answer that question, but sometimes doing that helps me articulate what God is teaching me. It is obvious that that is what you have just done. Honestly, if it weren't for the hope of seeing my daughter and grandchildren grow up more I would be ready to walk into His open arms right now. This is hard. I don't like it. But the whole process is drawing me deeper into my relationship with the the One True God who loves me no matter what, and this is temporary, that is not.
As you live this out your life and faith is a testimony to everyone around you. Would the person questioning you be able to face what you are facing with such strength, faith and dignity? Would they suddenly think that God expected them to do nothing in this life? Where in scripture are we called to do nothing? But one thing is sure, we are called to love God and one another and to rejoice in all things because of the hope we have in Him.
I also was diagnosed right when the news about the Herceptin trials broke. You should have seen how God went to work to get me that stuff! Long story short - I started Herceptin right on time with my first Taxol on May 1, 2005. If you look at the timing of that it is a miracle. Those around me watched it happen and God was glorified. He uses other people, INCLUDING THE MEDICAL PROFESSION to minister to us and to heal us. Do I believe He could flat out heal me? You bet He could. But then, as you said, I would be missing out on all He has taught me over these past 20 months about Himself, His character, His great love for me, and I wouldn't trade that for anything!

Keep up your diligance and your faith. They are both a testimony to God's work in your life.

[mary c]

This isn't so much a lack of faith, but it is about walking in someone else's shoes - on Friday I had my Navelbine appointment and then had to wait around the hospital for a CAT Scan - I was up around 6:30 to get to the hospital for 8:00 and my CAT Scan wasn't scheduled until after lunch - anyway, I was just not having the best days (emotionally) and when I entered the CAT Scan room the technologist (who was probably in her twenties) told me that I had to finish my top-up drink of that nasty stuff - I had chemo in the morning, and I just couldn't do it - anyway, I could feel the tears starting to come to my eyes and I tried to fight them back - I told her I couldn't drink it and she told me that I had to and then went on to say in a really nasty tone, "so, why are you crying anyway?" I was so stunned, I couldn't say a thing - all kinds of thoughts went through my mind like, "my first husband passed away when I was 27 and expecting our first child, I was diagnosed with breast cancer when I was 29 and I am now still fighting it(Stage 4) and will continue to do so for the rest of my life, etc. etc."
I just couldn't believe that she could have said that to me (and believe you me, when she asked why I was crying, she wasn't asking out of the kindness of her heart).
My husband met me right after the CAT Scan and noticed I had been crying - he immediately thought I had been given bad news - I couldn't even tell him why I was crying until we left the hospital because I knew I would probably break-down and just bawl there. Life certainly throws some curve-balls!

Mary

[CherylS]

Oh Mary,

Sometimes we have to laugh or we will cry, so I have to tell you what my friend did the other day. She was in the hospital having her entire shoulder replaced. The day after her surgery she was in so much pain and having a alergic reaction to the morphine and no one would answer the nurse call. She layed there for an hour and a half, and finally, picked up the phone and called the hospital main number! She told the person at the switch board to call the nurse station on her floor and tell them to get their butts in gear and help her or she was going to call 911 next!

It worked, they came.

God Bless

[sassy]

Kim, I'm sorry you have been challenged so, when life is challenging on its own right now.

I think a part of Faith is recognizing God in the many ways he presents himself to us. I too was dx just prior to herceptin being available and stepped right into Taxol/Herceptin after finishing A/C. Long story short, God was guiding me thru every step and decision that led me to herceptin, because I didn't start out on that path.

I am reminded of the story of the man in the flood. A huge flood was predicted and a man stood on his porch watching as the waters rose. His neighbors came by and called for him to come escape the waters with them, but he replied,"No, God will take care of me."

The waters continued to rise and the man climbed to the second story of his home. A rescue team in a boat came by and called for him to escape in the boat, but he replied, "No, God will take care of me."

The waters rose even more and the man climbed to the roof of his home. A helicopter hovered overhead, calling to the man that they were there to rescue him, but the man once again replied, "No, God will take care of me."

The waters rose and the man eventually drowned. As he reached the pearly gates, God was waiting for him. The man said to God, "God, I thought you would take care of me!" To which God replied, "I sent your neighbors, a boat and a team in a helicopter! What more do you expect of me?"

Faith carries responsibility, not passive acceptance of any situation. God gives us brains, and the free will to chose. I feel he expects us to use our knowledge and the knowledge of others to address whatever situation we find ourselves in, including medical situations. Faith includes realizing and using our talents and the talents of others for the betterment of all.

Stand firm in your Faith Kim. One who has not been challenged as we have may not have had the opportunity to explore the depths of their Faith and their relationship with God. Follow the avenues that are made available to you for your physical and mental health.

My prayer for all, every day, is that we SEE the opportunities that God gives to us each day---and that we use those opportunities to benefit others and ourselves. God does not give us opportunities to be wasted, but for our benefit and the benefit of others.

"For I know the plans I have for you," says the Lord. "They are plans for good and not for disaster, to give you a future and a hope." --Jeremiah 29:11-13

The future here.....and hereafter.
________
Ocean View Condo (http://pattayaluxurycondos.com)

[Hopeful]

Kimberly,

So much of dealing with bc is mental. We play enough mindgames with ourselves, the last thing we need is someone else to come along and lay a head trip on us. I personally would not dignify the question with an answer, but, since this came from someone obviously close to you, I can understand your need to respond. Just speak from your heart. The rationale doesn't matter. These slings and arrows do sting, but you have survived much worse than that already. Best of luck to you and have a happy Thanksgiving.

Hopeful

[G. Ann]

Kimberly, Your response to your "loved" one was very good. Sometimes we need to respond to comments and educate friends/family, and other times just let them slide. Before BC, I'm sure I made comments without thinking, and still goof at times. One of my good friends six months after chemo made a comment about how she was surprised I was still talking about cancer. It shut down our conversation immediately and I only tell her I'm doing "fine" if she asks.

I'm two years out from dx and chemo and almost finished with Herceptin. I try to keep my major concerns/comments for my BC support group and this forum. Others do not understand how unnerving their comments can be so why risk talking about it. I liked the St. Paul reference if we like to eat - we must work. Everyone should be vigilant about their health even without cancer in their history, by eating healthy & exercsing, etc., but a serious illness brings it all home.
Wishing you a very blessed Thanksgiving - G. Ann

[mary c]

Thanks Cheryl!
I know your friend didn't think it was funny at the time (and probably still doesn't), but you put a smile on my face. I had a bone scan done today - back at the same hospital, but today (as most times) everyone was so kind and caring - it is so strange how some days life seems to be fine, you forget all about cancer and then other days, one little pain in the back just starts to freak you out! It is so nice to know that other people feel the same way!

Mary

[Kimberly Lewis]

all for your replies. I think I was being oversensitive and and verbose now that I look back on it. Sounds like my diagnosis for this whole experience. Hope everyone had a happy holiday!

[Mary Anne in TX]

When I first got diagnosed, I called the one friend I thought would be the very best to encourage me and direct me towards the first step! Her advice was to pray (I'd been doing that nonstop!) and do alternative treatment! The second person I contacted advised me to go to Mexico immediately for treatment at a place where her husband was receiving treatment for cancer. No other place should even be considered!

I sat on all that for a few days and then called the 3rd (& I promised myself the last) friend! She not only cheered me on, but she called and paved the way for my consultation with the person who was to become my onc. and the coordinator of my treatment in San Antonio!

I continue to be amazed by comments and "directions" from "well wishers", but I try to remind myself that the intent is good, the form it takes is just skewed! I get hurt, mad, or depressed for a bit and then give my foggy brain time to kick in! I must admit that I am still taking "logs out of my eye" from my ill-advising past! I think we just do the best we can with who we are at the moment!

Your response was just great!

God bless and keep on smiling.

[TriciaK]

What wonderful responses, Kim, not only your response but the many you received from this board! As always I am so impressed with the depth and compassion of the people on this website. As many of you know, my husband and I are psychologists and counselors, and we have been absolutely shocked at some of the comments and advice unthinking friends and relatives often give to people who are in emotional, spiritual and physical pain. Instead of understanding, many times the "advice" is actually cruel and even damaging, and it is given not as a suggestion but in an overbearing harsh way. I don't know what is wrong with people who do that, but I suspect it is because they have never learned to be compassionate. If it is any comfort, the chances are very likely that that thoughtless person will someday learn compassion the hard way by having to go through some pain and suffering themselves. It is extremely rare that anyone gets through this life without it! Of course, not everyone learns compassion by their own suffering, some people just become bitter and hateful instead. Most people, though, are naturally kind, or at least mean to be. Those who aren't, well--they will have their turn to learn the hard way. As has been suggested, it is best to avoid hurtful people, and if you can't (usually because they are related!) then ignore them for their thoughtlessness. Your reply to them, Kim, is very wise and thoughtful.It is kind of you to try to explain your feelings, and if that other person isn't touched by your reply, then they can't be touched and deserve to be ignored! It is so good to have this website to share feelings with people who are truly compassionate and understanding! Hugs, Tricia

[Heart Sutra]

Thank you for being here.

We were told that "now that you are in the 11th hour, you are expected to accept (name of popular deity here) and know that his way is the only way to regaining your health"

Both of us subscribe to the thoughts of (our screen name is a clue) in which personal accountability and actions are at the fore, and being fully present is the key goal.
Don't want to get into that here, certainly not the place.

But I've always felt that having a faith (any) is a good thing in general, as it requires one to have an open mind. The trick is not to have such an open mind that your brains fall out.

Some well wishers have not taken that care, though they mean well. Sometimes their words of encouragement are more harmful than helpful, and it is only a lapse of careful speech that causes this. I've done this as well over the years, but I do try hard to correct it. As far as "being in the 11th hour..." well, we've never felt that way, and it hurt to hear someone describe us thus. We live in each moment as best we can, we've done this long before cancer came into our lives.

Thank you for bringing up what is obviously a common experience. This is helpful to us, and brings to mind that careless speech can be harmful.

---Kevin and Sue---