Herceptin and supplements

[DianneS]

This may already have been addressed but here goes.

Is it ok to take vitamins and antioxidants while taking Herceptin?

I didn't take antioxidants while doing chemo but began after to help support my immune system. But the immune system is what is under attack by Herceptin so should it be supported by antioxidants/vitamins or not? Am I hindering or helping the Herceptin? Are there any definitive studies about this? I'd sure hate to undo all the treatments I've gotten, and only have three more.

Your thoughts, ladies, please?

Diannes

[tricia keegan]

I'm sorry I don't know Dianne, I did'nt take anything at that time myself but maybe ask your onc to be sure.
Good luck with the rest of your treatments

[ElaineM]

You should consult a licensed naturopathic physician or licensed nutritionist who is familar with cancer treatment and Herceptin or a M. D. who practices integrative medicine.
Personally consulted a naturopathic physician, took supplements and ate as healthy as I could during Herceptin and chemotherapy.

[Carol.hope]

Dianne,
I have a Naturopathic Doctor who used to work in a cancer clinic, supporting patients through chemo. She recommended quite a few supplements throughout the process, only withholding one or two within a day or so of the A/C infusions. And definitely continuing them after, during Herceptin.

I think there are studies, but they are not done by the standard medical system's way - double blind, many people, etc - which is very expensive and can usually only be afforded by a drug company hoping to be able to sell a new drug from the outcome. Therefore, many oncologists cannot support them.

If you have enough energy to search on the web (which I sure didn't, but do now), you might find some studies.

Congratulations on being so close to finished!

- Carol

[Tom]

Dear Dianne,

The Herceptin is not fighting your immune system. The Herceptin is blocking cell signaling receptor sites on the surface of the malignant HER2 cells. Anything you can do to support or boost the immune system will help your body battle the disease at some level. Additionally, Herceptin is what is called a tyrosine kinase inhibitor. This is what works against the cancer. Inhibition of tyrosine kinase blocks the inappropriate messages from being sent from the cells surface that enable the cancer to grow. I believe there is a good illustration of this process somewhere on this website.

The reason I stress this is because one of the substances I always beleieved was very important in fighting HER2+ disease, is a compound found in green tea (EGCG). It turns out that EGCG is also a very potent tyrosine kinase inhibitor. I recommend drinking lots of fresh brewed green tea as well as taking a good quality green tea extract such as the ones offered by Life Extension www.LEF.org .

You can find lists here on her2support.org of many other supplements as well as foods that will help you fight the cancer. My personal favorite after green tea has always been curcumin, an ingredient in curry. There are refined versions of this substance available that would be of benefit to you as well. Read as much as you can about the many things that can help you here on the site. There are many folks here that can offer you suggestions on vitamins and supplements.

Tom

[DianneS]

Thank you Tom, for the info. I have been drinking organic green tea for quite awhile, and also organic matcha tea.

I have a good naturopathic doctor in town and have been getting antioxidant pills from her as well as a tincture to try to help my body. I have read about cumin, and tumeric as well (which is one of the ingredients she has put in the tincture). Tumeric has been found to actually shrink some tumour - interesting to read about it if you want to google it.

Also thank you for the explanation about her2 and Herceptin. That helps explain what is going on.

I do have one question about the whole process: I have read that her2 overproduction is a chromosonal defect on chromosone #17. Does Herceptin alter this chromosone? After stopping Herceptin, does the process that Herceptin began continue?

Dianne

[R.B.]

Please check out this thread.

http://her2support.org/vbulletin/sho...ght=greek+diet

Trials suggest strong synergies with Omega 3s.

Omega 6 may increase her2 expression. (paper towards end of thread)

[ElaineM]

For an explanation of how the antibody drug Herceptin works you can go to www.herceptin.com. For an explanation of how the Kinase inhibitor Tykerb works you can go to www.tykerb.com.
M. D. Anderson has a section about supplements on their website You can also go to the NIH website or the NCCAM website as well as other reliable websites about supplements and cancer.

[Becky]

Besides drinking green tea, I took my Omega 3, vitamin D, CoQ 10 and I took maitake mushroom capsules (lots of them - far more than I take now). This is because for Herceptin to work properly, the pTEN must be activated. Some people have activated, some people have inactive (some people don't have it at all). So, just in case mine was inactive, I took maitake because the beta glucan in it can activate PTEN.

I also took (and continue to take) olive leaf and curcumin. I took all this on Herceptin.

On chemo I took a multi, Omega 3, olive oil off the spoon and curcumin. I added the others after rads (had late Herceptin and just tossed antioxidants in then).

I drank green tea the whole time - just no extra capsules during chemo.

[ElaineM]

It has been interesting reading about the various supplements members use. Maybe we just need a complementary medicine Forum that includes nutrition, supplements, acupuncture, various forms of exercise,
massage, acupressure and other things people are using to complement their conventional therapies and be healthy.

[Ljiljana]

Hello beautiful ladies! I was reading this and... I was wondering one thing... Since I'm taking Taxol/Herceptin therapy now... I'm taking Omega3 supplments also, but... On the bottle it says that it regenerates cell membranes. Herceptin should be blocking it, isn't it? So isn't Omega3 supplement contra-effect on Herceptine? Because maybe it unblocks signals that Herceptine blocks? Or not? I was just wondering, I am not microbiologist, but a simple homemade. Could anyone answer this to me?
I realize that Omega3 are perfect for protection. I was just wondering if it maybe is not good in combination with Herceptine... Thank you very much.

[Jackie07]

Hi,
There is a good illustration of the Her2 Pathway on the Home page:


HOME

-------Her2 Breast Cancer (2nd bar on top of the Board)


----------Her2 Gene


-----------------Guide to Her2


------------------------Section 4: The Her2 Pathway


It appears that taking Omega 3 supplement is safe because Herceptin uses a special pathway and doesn't look like there will be any interferrence. Herceptin blocks the Her2 signal so cancer cells will not proliferate. Omega3 supplies the needed ingredience to mend the cell membrane and speeds up the recovery of normal cells.

That's my take from the information presented on the page.

[Mary L]

My onc has me taking Omega 3. I have been on it quite awhile. It helped my heart heal from the Herceptin. Mary L

[Ljiljana]

Oh, thank you, thank you, thank you!
I founded this forum just few days ago, and... Now I am so happy!
U are wonderfull!

[TanyaRD]

Sorry to come in late on this conversation. I usually stay in the "Diet and Nutrition" section only but would like to comment on this thread.

Generally speaking, the chemotherapy/cancer treatment agents we are most careful with in regards to antioxidants are those that produce free radicals. I am pasting a chart below.

Table 1: Chemotherapeutic Agents Producing Free Radicals

• Alkylating agents
  cisplatin (Platinol®)
  carboplarin (Paraplatin®)
  chlorambucil (Leukeran®)
  carmustine (BiCNU®)
  cyclophosphamide (Cytoxan®)
  busulfan (Myleran®)
  ifosfamide (Ifex®)
• Anthracyclines
  doxorubicin (Adriamycin®, Doxil®)
  daunorubicin (Cerubidine®)
  epirubicin (Ellence®)
  Mitomycin (Mutamycin®)
  BIeomycin (Bleoxane®)
• Podophyllum agents
  etoposide(VP-I6, Vespid®)
  teniposide (Vumon®)

Some evidence demonstrates that high dose antioxidants (amount in diet is usually much lower and safe with treatment) may make treatment less effective.

Herceptin does not fall into these categories. I am generally cautious with my patients and recommend they get their antioxidants from food. I often recommend an Omega-3 supplement, calcium and vitamin D which all appear safe in combination with Herceptin.

Hope this is helpful.

Tanya
(Registered Dietitian)

[Ljiljana]

Yes, it was very, very helpful. Many thanks. You are wonderful!

[weety]

I don't think anyone really knows the answer to your question and that's the problem with all cancers and chemos and meds and the list goes on. But. . . my philosophy was to change it up a little bit each time I went in for herceptin. That way, if I was inhibiting it, it wouldn't be inhibitited every time! LOL (for example, if I drank coffee before an infusion, the next week, I made sure I had NO coffee the day or 2 beforehand) I know it sounds crazy, but I just was so scared about the same thing you asked about!!!

[Ljiljana]

hmmm... It's intersting how you think... creatively. I'll consider it deffinately. Thank you for sharing.