?????

anyone know the benefit of taking herceptin alone after chemo. I did not have taxol, just 4xac. Anyone know what benefit I can recieve for taking herceptin alone?

[al from Canada]

Although chemo may kill cancer cells it doesn't change your HER2 status. It's the HER2 receptors attached to the cell membranes that will create further aberrations that will turn regular cells into cancerous ones. By pugging those receptors with herceptin, you render them inoperable thus the probability of reoccurance is greatly reduced.

The short answer is that it is to your benefit to take herceptin both with the taxol and after it.
Regards,
Al.

right, but what is the overall statistical advantage to herceptin alone. I had a very small tumor and it was not in my nodes there for the drs. said that the risks of taxol outweighed the benefits of 1%. There for I have heard that herceptin has a 50% benefit with chemo, what is the benefit alone after chemo? Anyone know.

[karenann]

The HERA trial used Herceptin after chemo (all different types of chemo) was completed and although the final results aren't in yet, the trial is showing a 46% cut in recurrence. I am receiving Herceptin after completing dose dense AC & T. I started 2 weeks after my last Taxol. I had a 1.3cm tumor, no lymph node involvement, stage 1. I had to push for the Herceptin because my doc said I didn't need it with my early stage and good prognosis.

If you want to find information on the HERA trial, got to breastcancer.org and type in HERA trial.

Karen

[Becky]

The benefit of recurrence reduction of herceptin + taxol is 52%. The benefit of recurrence reduction of herceptin alone (after completing some type of chemo regime) is 46%.


Becky

[AlaskaAngel]

So... WHY, sientifically speaking, would oncs think it is not likely to be effective for those who are over a year out compared to someone who is only a few months out?

I can give see where just maybe the risk/benefit for a late Stage I might not be impressive enough for them, but what is the scientific principle behind not being more liberal about it in regard to someone who is stage II? Why would it "work" any differently just because of time... I grasp that the more time that goes by, the more dominant any remaining cancer might be in overwhelming the immune system and Herceptin... but in that case, why wait, since it would seem more logical to get going with it the sooner the better anyhow?

AlaskaAngel

[karenann]

AA,

If I were you, I would push for the Herceptin.

Karen

[AlaskaAngel]

I do have approval for it from my regular onc, who neither promoted it for me nor discouraged it. The consulting onc even refused to FISH me. I am being stubborn about trying as hard as I can to "see" it from the viewpoint of the oncs who are reluctant or "not enthusiastic". Do they really not comprehend that once somebody has gone through chemo and rads, etc., that getting such flimsy and unclear reasons for being prevented from having Herceptin just does not seem like a rational extension of the clinical trial data or make much sense?

A.A.

[karenann]

AA,

Have you thought about calling UCSF or Stanford to talk to an onc there? Teaching hospitals that work with trials, etc. may have a different opinion. I went to Stanford for a 3rd opinion and the onc I saw there is working with the Her2 trials and the Her2 vaccine.

Just a thought.

Karen

Has anybody checked to see if there are any trials / results for herceptin alone.

I equally have been puzzelled by suggestions it may not be effective without chemo.

If this is the case why?

RB

[karenann]

Robin,

When you say alone, do you mean without having received any chemo or do you mean after completing chemo? The Hera trial, as I am sure you know, gave Herceptin after completion of all different types of chemo and they had a 46% cut in recurrence.

Karen

AlaskaAngel,
I went to UCSF and was told by the onc that herceptin would "most certainly would not be approved for herceptin" because I was node neg and well under 1cmm. However, here I am in Sacramento recieving herceptin. I think you just need to keep hunting around until you find someone who will say yes and then go for it. Where can I read info on the Hera trial? My onc said that herceptin was just 33% effective for me given that it is given after chemo and with out taxol.

[Becky]

www.heratrial.com

[karenann]

Also, breastcancer.org and type in Hera trial. Where in Sacramento are you? I live in Walnut Creek, which is an hour drive from there.

Karen

[AlaskaAngel]

Thanks Karen Ann, Becky and Al for helping with data and other info.

Not taking the Herceptin is sort of like being in a police line-up in reverse, with most being innocent but some not, and no way to tell which is which, and no help at all from those in charge of the line-up, who would rather let everybody just go until the "next time" that they already know will happen.

In considering RB's question, if Herceptin is not effective when used without any chemo at all, is that maybe because if you give it at a high enough level to tie up enough receptors it would be far too toxic, so it needs chemo to help out?

AlaskaAngel

P.S. KarenAnn/Walnut Creek, and "Sacramento", I visit your territory now and then and would enjoy a cup of... decaf... with you somewhere in time. Thanks for the support in considering Herceptin!

[karenann]

AA,

Let me know when you are in town...I would love to meet you for some coffee. By the way, I sure did not mean to put pressure on you regarding Herceptin. I was just trying to help.

Karen

[suzan w]

I had a bilateral mastectomy in June '05, node neg, ER+,PR+,Her2+. All other scans ned. Small (7mm) tumor. My onc. said that if it were not for the Her2+, I would only need arimidex (for ER+). I had the Oncotype DX test, showed a high intermediate risk for recurrence. Based on that info my onc recommended 4 cycles of A/C- didn't feel taxol was in order as the A/C was a "preventative measure"(her words), Followed by a year of herceptin/3 week cycles. So far, so good...it all seems like such a guessing game!