The traditional diet of Greece and cancer.

[R.B.]

Thank you for your comment. All debate is good. I have not looked at the Lyon study in detail

http://www.americanheart.org/present...dentifier=4655

but there is a huge amount of evidence that diet has potential impact on risk factors for disease. At the most basic levels diet influences gene expression which is a fundamental mechanism in regulating body function.

If you get time you mike like to look at some of the links provided which in turn open out into a plethora of further trials. If you search on NCBI and dietary factors of interesrt and cancer you will find a huge number of trials.

Here is a view from the Mayo Clinic



http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/fis...atient-fishoil

"There is evidence from multiple large-scale population (epidemiologic) studies and randomized controlled trials that intake of recommended amounts of DHA and EPA in the form of dietary fish or fish oil supplements lowers triglycerides, reduces the risk of death, heart attack, dangerous abnormal heart rhythms, and strokes in people with known cardiovascular disease, slows the buildup of atherosclerotic plaques ("hardening of the arteries"), and lowers blood pressure slightly. However, high doses may have harmful effects, such as an increased risk of bleeding. Although similar benefits are proposed for alpha-linolenic acid, scientific evidence is less compelling, and beneficial effects may be less pronounced."

RB

[R.B.]

Just to bring this forward again as diet is a topic at the moment.

RB

[julierene]

I'm not sure why this was brought back up with the last post. It seems to be an argument for NOT taking the Omega-3's. All it seems to say is that it helps with the heart - NOT HELPFUL FOR THOSE OF US WHO ARE GOING TO DIE FROM CANCER FIRST! And that increased doses (which could very well be that of the widely sold dosage on the shelf) cause harmful effects. This is exactly why I think it's dangerous to be playing around with all the supplements. There is no telling if the cocktail of supplements many women take is harmful OR helpful.

This whole idea of balancing Omega 3 and 6 is great... but I have never once seen evidence to tell us how to do it on a daily basis with our diet - naturally. I'm a natural freak... and fish oil capsules gave me burping I couldn't deal with, fowl urine, and terrible gas... So I have looked for answers on the topic and never seen anything. Most on this site seem to push the capsules, which my system just can't tolerate.


I am definetly not on the fence with most of the women here about taking supplements - especially high doses... A good multi vitamin should be sufficient with a well balanced diet. I think something most people should do is - listen to their bodies. If high doses of this and that cause ulcers... don't take them! If it makes them feel better and is considered safe - have at it. I just don't think dietary factors play as much of a role as we would like them to. The virus thread was much more alarming to me - and probably holds a lot more weight to what we all seem to run from. Our own DNA and the constant effect viruses have on our own genetic makeup.

[R.B.]

Why did I bring up the coronary issue

Because a previous post suggested omega three had no impact on coronary health. A positive impact on coronary health is one of the area that does seem to be accepted by a growing number of the medical profession.

Re impact of omega three - it is complex. The eicosanoid pathway is fundamental to the bodies mechanisms, and omega three and six play a very big part in it. Omega three and six have been reported as impacting on a huge number of health issues.

Re repeating - I take oil and not capsules. I used ot have a problem with repeating with cod liver oils oils but do not have a problem with the seven seas extra strength or Vita Cost Carlsons lemon flavoured. I do not know if these oils are more refined. Omega three has been shown to reduce IBS which is a factor in poor digestion.

Food does alter gene expression, this includes BRAC and HER 2. the difference between a high omega six and balanced 3/6 has been shown to produce changes of gene expression by a factor of ten for some gene in rodents. There are a number of small trials suggesting that omega three intake does play a part in cancer risk reduction, but there is a lack of wider trials

This is a good starting point on the huge subject of fats.

http://www.benbest.com/health/essfat.html

Other supplements is a whole huge other issue on which I make no comment.

To balance the omega threes and sixes you have to look at your intake and fat content. This is a good link. It is a bore at first but it does not take long to get an idea as to what contains high levels of omega six.

http://www.nutritiondata.com/topics/fatty-acids

Otherwise it is more of the usual - avoid processed foods, sugar, trans fats,....lots of variety - lots of green things - small quantity of nuts - as generally discussed in many healthy eating books.

It is not easy, there is much mixed information and my suggestion is to read round the topic and come to your own conclusions.


RB

[heblaj01]

Julierene,
You appear to have difficulties in digesting fish oil pills. Setting aside an allergy to seafood, it is possible you need taking digestive enzymes at the same time as the oil pills, in particular the lipase enzyme.
Lipase & other digestive enzymes are also indicated for some people with poor bile &/or pancreatic secretion or whose gallbladder has been resected or is not functioning because it is filled with stones. I am in this latter category & I take enzyme supplements with oil pills.
It is also preferable to take oil pills at the end of meals.

NOTE:
A simple check to find out if someone has problems in digesting fats is the color of stools: yellowish is indicative of poor digestion.

[R.B.]

More indications fats are in the thick of things....

DEFINATELY WORTH STRUGGLING TO UNDERSTAND


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=17168666

ABSTRACT

"A recent discovery that dietary fatty acids can interact with the human genome by regulating the amount and/or activity of transcription factors has opened a whole new line of research aimed to molecularly corroborate the ant-cancer benefits of the olive oil-based Mediterranean diet and the underlying mechanisms. Our most recent findings reveal that oleic acid (OA; 18:1n-9), the main olive oil's monounsaturated fatty acid, can suppress the overexpression of HER2 (erbB-2), a well-characterized oncogene playing a key role in the etiology, invasive progression and metastasis in several human cancers."

and

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=17134970

ABSTRACT

"CONCLUSIONS: i) These findings reveal that the omega-3 PUFA ALA suppresses overexpression of HER2 oncogene at the transcriptional level, which, in turn, interacts synergistically with anti-HER2 trastuzumab- based immunotherapy. ii) Our results molecularly support a recent randomized double-blind placebo-controlled clinical trial suggesting that ALA may be a potential dietary alternative or adjunct to currently used drugs in the management of HER2-positive breast carcinomas. iii) Considering our previous findings demonstrating the <<HER2 upregulatory actions>> of the omega-6 PUFA linolenic acid (LA; 18:2n-6) and the <<HER2 down-regulatory actions >> of the omega-3 PUFA docosahexaenoic acid (DHA; 22:6n-3) and of the omega-9 monounsaturated fatty acid oleic acid (OA; 18:1n-9), it is reasonable to suggest that a low omega-6/omega-3 PUFA ratio and elevated MUFA levels, the two prominent <<fat features>> of the <<Mediterranean diet>>, should be extremely efficient at blocking HER2 expression in breast cancer cells."

RB

[R.B.]

Just bringing this back up the list for anybody who may not have seen it in case of interest.

RB

[R.B.]

Just bringing this back for anybody new on the forum, and adding a link to some trials suggesting long chain omega three intake is linked with a reduction in the risk of BC.

Please do talk to your ad visors about significant dietary changes. Fish oil can cause blood thinning etc.


RB



http://www.her2support.org/vbulletin...638#post118638

and some more

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=16823509

ABSTRACT

"Essential fatty acids have long been identified as possible oncogenic factors. Existing reports suggest omega-6 (omega-6) essential fatty acids (EFA) as pro-oncogenic and omega-3 (omega-3) EFA as anti-oncogenic factors. The omega-3 fatty acids, eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA), inhibit the growth of human breast cancer cells while the omega-6 fatty acids induces growth of these cells in animal models and cell lines."




http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=15986129

ABSTRACT

"The omega-3 fatty acids, eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA), inhibit the growth of human breast cancer cells in animal models and cell lines, but the mechanism by which this occurs is not well understood."


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...t_uids=9816126

[RBs comment - this is an older trial in mice but does raise the issue of the role of omega sixes - which are essential to human health but many question have been raised as to the impact where omega three and six are significantly out of balance]



ABSTRACT

"We showed previously that a diet rich in linoleic acid (LA), an omega-6 fatty acid, stimulates the growth and metastasis of human breast cancer cells in athymic nude mice. In contrast, diets supplemented with eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) or docosahexaenoic acid (DHA), omega-3 fatty acids, exert suppressive effects."

[kat in the delta]

Hi --I have been talking to a MD who is also a Nutritionist and and she informed me about a whole food not really an extra supplement but --for those of us who do NOT get enough: green veggies, fruit, or berries in our diets. This has LOTs of research and I know 5 MD's, and others who are NOW HEALTHIER because of it. Some of you may have heard about it..For those who haven't, go to this site and if possible somewhere there, mention you heard about it from Kathy in Mississippi. GO TO: www.juiceplusmed.com Tell me what YOU think........kat in the MS delta

ps--you cannot buy it from a store--but if you'd like to order some please e-mail me: katcdale@yahoo.com ,and I will foward to DR. Kim. Thanks. kat in the delta

[R.B.]

The best source is likely to be a very wide ranging diet of whole veg etc, but a practical level many of us do not achieve that so there is a school of thought that green supplements are useful to widen our diet etc.

There are lots

http://www.google.co.uk/search?clien...=Google+Search

Green Frog is one of a number I have used.

http://www.vitacost.com/productResul...t=green%20frog

[R.B.]

The benefits of omega three are not restricted to potentially reducing the risk profile of BC. but are wide ranging including brain function.

Previous posts have included suggestions that cancerous brain cells have exhibited high levels of omega six.



Omega-3 fatty acids: evidence basis for treatment and future research in psychiatry.

Abstract

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum

"The preponderance of epidemiologic and tissue compositional studies supports a protective effect of omega-3 EFA intake, particularly eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA), in mood disorders."


RB

[R.B.]

Please talk to your advisor about significant dietary change. Omega threes can cause blood thinning etc.



http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=12416257

Abstract

"We conclude that total n-6 PUFAs may be contributing to the high risk of breast cancer in the United States and that LC n-3 PUFAs, derived from fish oils, may have a protective effect."

[R.B.]

I have posted this result before but it is so striking I have included it again. It is based on comparing fat in breast tissue to whether or not lumps were invasive.

Women in the third with the highest levels of DHA had about 30% of the number of invasive results compared with the women in the third with the lowest levels of DHA.

Another trial suggests that the fat composition in the breast will change significantly in a few months with change in diet. Eg eat more omega three and less omega six and it will show up significantly in your breast tissue in a matter of months

As usual please discuss dietary changes with your advisors.

There are no definitive answers so I can only suggest you try and read round the subject a little too.



http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=11857389

ABSTRACT

Experimental studies have indicated that n-3 fatty acids, including alpha-linolenic acid (18:3 n-3) and long-chain n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids inhibit mammary tumor growth and metastasis. Earlier epidemiological studies have given inconclusive results about a potential protective effect of dietary n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids on breast cancer risk, possibly because of methodological issues inherent to nutritional epidemiology. To evaluate the hypothesis that n-3 fatty acids protect against breast cancer, we examined the fatty acid composition in adipose tissue from 241 patients with invasive, nonmetastatic breast carcinoma and from 88 patients with benign breast disease, in a case-control study in Tours, central France. Fatty acid composition in breast adipose tissue was used as a qualitative biomarker of past dietary intake of fatty acids. Biopsies of adipose tissue were obtained at the time of surgery. Individual fatty acids were measured as a percentage of total fatty acids, using capillary gas chromatography. Unconditional logistic regression modeling was used to obtain odds ratio estimates while adjusting for age, height, menopausal status and body mass index. We found inverse associations between breast cancer-risk and n-3 fatty acid levels in breast adipose tissue. Women in the highest tertile of alpha-linolenic acid (18:3 n-3) had an odds ratio of 0.39 (95% confidence intervals [CI] = 0.19-0.78) compared to women in the lowest tertile (trend p = 0.01). In a similar way, women in the highest tertile of docosahexaenoic acid (22:6 n-3) had an odds ratio of 0.31 (95% CI = 0.13-0.75) compared to women in the lowest tertile (trend p = 0.016). Women in the highest tertile of the long-chain n-3/total n-6 ratio had an odds ratio of 0.33 (95% confidence interval = 0.17-0.66) compared to women in the lowest tertile (trend p = 0.0002). In conclusion, our data based on fatty acids levels in breast adipose tissue suggest a protective effect of n-3 fatty acids on breast cancer risk and support the hypothesis that the balance between n-3 and n-6 fatty acids plays a role in breast cancer. Copyright 2001 Wiley-Liss, Inc.

PMID: 11857389 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

[dng]

Here is a good review of omega 3 from MD anderson

http://www.mdanderson.org/department...0100508b603a14

[R.B.]

Thank you DNG.

It is indeed a very useful and informative resource - a recommended bookmark and skim / read.

RB

[RobinP]

I just found this article to have sound physiological reasons for why diet and lifestyle MAY help to prevent breast cancer. I think that some of us, with some of the worse genes, would still get bc no matter what, then others may benifit from lifestyle changes. Personally, I think one of the biggest reasons for bc since the 1940s has been due to environmental estrogen drugs found in food and in human medication sources such as the pill, oxytocin, plastics, HRT for the older than 50 yr. old,etc. Still, that doesn't mean that a good diet may help to prevent or lessen the aggressieness of the bc.

[R.B.]

Foods alter the way we express our genes (switch on and the number we switch on and where) and that includes Her2 BRAC1 etc.

Expression can be dramatically changed by diet.

The China Study a book by T Colin Campbell about $25US makes thought provoking reading.

[R.B.]

In essence much still to know but for HER 2

Omega three - good
Omega nine - good
low Omega six - good

Clearly as usual it is not that simple but the summary below adds to the weight of evidence that strict moderation of fat intake, balancing the omega threes and sixes and quality of intake are well worth serious consideration.

As usual if undertaking significant dietary change please talk to your advisers.





http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=17134970

ABSTRACT

CONCLUSIONS: i) These findings reveal that the omega-3 PUFA ALA suppresses overexpression of HER2 oncogene at the transcriptional level, which, in turn, interacts synergistically with anti-HER2 trastuzumab- based immunotherapy. ii) Our results molecularly support a recent randomized double-blind placebo-controlled clinical trial suggesting that ALA may be a potential dietary alternative or adjunct to currently used drugs in the management of HER2-positive breast carcinomas. iii) Considering our previous findings demonstrating the <<HER2 upregulatory actions>> of the omega-6 PUFA linolenic acid (LA; 18:2n-6) and the <<HER2 down-regulatory actions >> of the omega-3 PUFA docosahexaenoic acid (DHA; 22:6n-3) and of the omega-9 monounsaturated fatty acid oleic acid (OA; 18:1n-9), it is reasonable to suggest that a low omega-6/omega-3 PUFA ratio and elevated MUFA levels, the two prominent <<fat features>> of the <<Mediterranean diet>>, should be extremely efficient at blocking HER2 expression in breast cancer cells.

[Becky]

Bringing this to the top for Nancy d

[R.B.]

Just bring this back for anybody new who may not have seen it.

RB