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08-28-2006, 09:14 AM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ft. Collins, Colorado
Posts: 546
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darnit
Well, I had a bit of a shock at my local oncs office today. My liver mets have grown significantly since finishing taxol/carbo in July. I can't believe how big they are. I start Navelbine with weekly herceptin tomorrow. I don't mind starting the chemo tomorrow, I'm just really freaked out at how aggressive this thing is. What if it doesn't work? Is it still possible to beat these things back down again? The mets are almost as big as they were when I was re-diagnosed 4 years ago and it was bad.
I just restocked supplements yesterday and really focused on liver oriented things. Any advice? Things I can do to augment? Any encouraging studies? I'm just reeling right now.
__________________
with love and gratitude,
joy
dx stage I 2/2000*er/pr+; her- per IHC*lumpectomy*4 rounds A/C*30 rads*tamoxifen*dx stage 4 5/2002*huge mets to liver*tiny mets to lungs*stopped tamoxifen*5/02 taxotere/xeloda*her 2 checked with FiSH-her2+++herceptin *2/03 stopped chemo femara w/herceptin*zolodex*04 switched to aromasin w/herceptin*05 high estrogen tx*11/05taxol/carbo*7/06 stopped chemo; megace/herceptin*9/06navelbine/herceptin*5/07tykerb/xeloda great response*4/08 progression in liver; ooph/ faslodex /herceptin
6/08 began Herceptin DM-1
9/08 progression
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08-28-2006, 09:42 AM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Acworth, GA
Posts: 2,104
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Yes, it's possible to beat the mets down again. You did it before and you will do it again. You're in my thoughts and prayers.
__________________
Kate
Stage IIIC Diagnosed Oct 25, 2005 (age 58)
ER/PR-, HER2+++, grade 3, Ploidy/DNA index: Aneuploid/1.61, S-phase: 24.2%
Neoadjunct chemo: 4 A/C; 4 Taxatore
Bilateral mastectomy June 8, 2006
14 of 26 nodes positive
Herceptin June 22, 2006 - April 20, 2007
Radiation (X35) July 24-September 11, 2006
BRCA1/BRCA2 negative
Stage IV lung mets July 13, 2007 - TCH
Single brain met - August 6, 2007 -CyberKnife
Oct 2007 - clear brain MRI and lung mets shrinking.
March 2008 lung met progression, brain still clear - begin Tykerb/Xeloda/Ixempra
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08-28-2006, 10:04 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 1,516
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Joy...
unfortunately, I have no advise, but I do have prayers. Take care and God bless.
Rhonda
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Rhonda
Dx 2/1/05, Stage 1, 0 nodes, Grade 3, ER/PR-, HER2+ (3.16 Fish)
2/7/05, Partial Mastectomy
5/18/05 Finished 6 rounds of dose dense TEC (Taxotere, Epirubicin and Cytoxan)
8/1/05 Finished 33 rads
8/18/05 Started Herceptin, every 3 weeks for a year (last one 8/10/06)
2/1/13...8 year Cancerversary and I am "perfect" (at least where cancer is concerned;)
" And in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years."- Abraham Lincoln
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08-28-2006, 10:05 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Stockton, NJ
Posts: 4,179
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Dear Joy
I am glad to see you are back online but sorry that the last chemo regime didn't work for you. Navelbine is a good drug. See if your onc will add Avastin to the mix. Another thing is Celebrex as a Cox 2 inhibitor (I saw in your list of supplements you do take an herbal mix that acts as a Cox 2 inhibitor) but maybe the drug will do you some good.
Vitamin D (at least 1000 IU per day via supplements and/or food) can be very helpful. Is your antihormonal working? Maybe a change to Faslodex might be warranted now unless your onc is absolutely certain your antihormonal is working.
Have your onc start the process or at least get the paperwork to get Tykerb as compassionate use. This way, if you need it, you are ready to go. The info on how to do this is posted as a sticky from Joe.
I will keep thinking and let you know everything else I come up with.
Hugs to you
Becky
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08-28-2006, 10:37 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 752
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Joy;
Becky just questioned whether your anti-hormone is working. This is a good idea as it doesn't work for everyone I understand. It reminded me that Becky told me previously that your onc could run your estradiol levels to check possibility this out. I will copy her entire comment so you can take it with you to your onc.
"When I went to ASCO I saw a post about a study on Stage 4 women with bone mets only. The researcher used only an antihormonal on these women and measured response. This paper indicated that when estradiol levels went up over 20 (I will see if I have a copy of this paper to include the units of measure), this was an indication that the AI wasn't working.
I asked what she did with these women after that - she commented on Faslodex or Tamoxifen (she indicated tamox is fine for Her2+ women as long as they are also on Herceptin).
So... I come back from ASCO and have my onc run estradiol when they do the cancer marker tests. Result comes back as less than 30. So, I call my onc and ask for the exact number. Well, Quest and Labcorp's lowest reading is less than 30 (which he says is a good number - I am on Arimidex too). So, apparently, these normal labs can't measure lower (I went to a seminar that said in a postmenopausal woman, an AI can take the estradiol level to 1 or 2). So, according to a normal lab, my estradiol level is as low as they can measure it.
Ask your onc about this. Estradiol levels can be measured. Maybe the lab you use has a more sensitive test than the ones we use. Apparently, in a research setting, they can use expensive, sensitive tests."
We'll all keep looking for other ideas. Hang in there.
Cathy
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Cathy
Diagnosed Oct. 2004 3 cm ductal, lumpectomy Nov. 2004
Diagnosed Jan. 2005 tumor in supraclavicular node
Stage 3c, Grade 3, ER/PR+, Her2++
4 AC, 4 Taxol, Radiation, Arimidex, Actonel
Herceptin for 9 months until Muga dropped and heart enlarged
Restarting herceptin weekly after 4 months off
Stopped herceptin after four weekly treatments....score dropped to 41
Finished 6 years Arimidex
May 2015 diagnosed with ovarian cancer
Stage 1C
started 6 treatments of carboplatin/taxol
Genetic testing show BRCA1 VUS
Nice! My hair came back really curly. Hope it lasts lol. Well it didn't but I liked it so I'm now a perm lady
29 March 2018 Lung biopsy following chest CT showing tumours in pleura of left lung, waiting for results to the question bc or ovarian
April 20, 2018 BC mets confirmed, ER/PR+ now Her2-
Questions about the possibility of ovarian spread and mets to bones so will be tested and monitored for these.
To begin new drug Palbociclib (Ibrance) along with Letrozole May, 2018.
Genetic testing of ovarian tumour and this new lung met will take months.
To see geneticist to be retested for BRCA this week....still BRCA VUS
CA125 has declined from 359 to 12 as of Aug.23/18
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08-28-2006, 02:23 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 476
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I would add ganoderma pills as a herbal treatment. There is no harm to take these mushroom derived extracts. Ganoderma seems to have a particular effect on liver cancers.
Ann
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08-28-2006, 06:59 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Misty woods of WA State
Posts: 4,128
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Don't know about Ganoderma
But, being a survivor of aggressive breast cancer mets to my liver, I do know that Milk Thistle (Standardized) seemed to have helped me. I did take some mushrooms but feel the best way is eating fresh ones. Shiitake are supposed to be excellent with anticancer properties. I ate a lot of them along with my chemos and still do eat them. I am able to get organically grown at a couple of local stores. There are many ways to fix them.
I also take Lions Mane Mushroom supplement to help alleviate "foggy thinking and memory" due to so much treatment. It seems to help.
Really feel bad for your situation with the tumors gaining some ground, but there surely is a combination that will work against them. I like some of Becky's thoughts. Tumors like the liver as there is such a good blood supply. A drug like Avastin that interrupts the blood supply to tumors might be a good idea.
__________________
"When I hear music, I fear no danger. I am invulnerable. I see no foe. I am related to the earliest times, and to the latest." H.D. Thoreau
Live in the moment.
MY STORY SO FAR ~~~~
Found suspicious lump 9/2000
Lumpectomy, then node dissection and port placement
Stage IIB, 8 pos nodes of 18, Grade 3, ER & PR -
Adriamycin 12 weekly, taxotere 4 rounds
36 rads - very little burning
3 mos after rads liver full of tumors, Stage IV Jan 2002, one spot on sternum
Weekly Taxol, Navelbine, Herceptin for 27 rounds to NED!
2003 & 2004 no active disease - 3 weekly Herceptin + Zometa
Jan 2005 two mets to brain - Gamma Knife on Jan 18
All clear until treated cerebellum spot showing activity on Jan 2006 brain MRI & brain PET
Brain surgery on Feb 9, 2006 - no cancer, 100% radiation necrosis - tumor was still dying
Continue as NED while on Herceptin & quarterly Zometa
Fall-2006 - off Zometa - watching one small brain spot (scar?)
2007 - spot/scar in brain stable - finished anticoagulation therapy for clot along my port-a-catheter - 3 angioplasties to unblock vena cava
2008 - Brain and body still NED! Port removed and scans in Dec.
Dec 2008 - stop Herceptin - Vaccine Trial at U of W begun in Oct. of 2011
STILL NED everywhere in Feb 2014 - on wing & prayer
7/14 - Started twice yearly Zometa for my bones
Jan. 2015 checkup still shows NED
2015 Neuropathy in feet - otherwise all OK - still NED.
Same news for 2016 and all of 2017.
Nov of 2017 - had small skin cancer removed from my face. Will have Zometa end of Jan. 2018.
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08-29-2006, 09:36 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 484
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I would also research some of the different breast cancer diets to find one that you think will work for you. The liver will be taxed trying to heal as well as trying to process the chemo treatments, so your diet can help lighten the liver's work load.
When I first began Navelbine for extensive liver mets, I felt the sickest as the liver mets were dying off and my body was processing the dead cancer cells. Navelbine worked great for me, hope you have the same results.
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08-29-2006, 06:36 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 589
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Joy,
I'm really sorry to hear about your new challenge. Everyones advice seems great so I'm sending caring and positive thoughts your way.
Eric
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