Something needs to be confirmed by Kathy from Tokyo

Jackie07 · 06-30-2009, 10:13 PM

http://press.princeton.edu/titles/7171.html

ElaineM · 07-01-2009, 12:21 PM

I don't know what Kathy thinks, but there are Buddhist priests and ministers from Buddhist denominations in Japan who are practicing their faith and leading their congregations in Hawaii who are married with children and who eat meat. I belong to an interfaith peace organization in Hawaii,so I interact and work with those folks all the time.

Jackie07 · 07-01-2009, 01:19 PM

Must be an interesting experience for you. Somehow it reminded me of the movie "Autumn Moon Tea House" in which Marlon Brando played a Japanese in Okinawa. (And he did a good, though strange, job.) It did not have a 'priest' in the script, but was an interesting story discussing the 'misconception' westerners commonly had about 'Geisha' in Japan.

Seems the 'Karate kids' movies continued the tradition of describing the cultural exchange (and 'conflict') of Japan and the West.

Believe51 · 07-02-2009, 05:01 PM

Jackie could you do me a favor?? When you do talk to Kathy, please send her my regards. Let her know I am thinking about her and sending her a cyberhug. Thanks pal and here is a wink for you (wink)>>Believe51

Kathy S in Tokyo · 07-03-2009, 05:28 AM

Hi Jackie and Believe - This thread made me smile. The Buddhist priests I've met in Japan have all been married and their children were expected to take over the temple with each generation. In the country town where I stayed for my first year, the local priest also owned and operated several bars with pretty hostesses and a drove fancy cars.

There is a British woman in southern Japan who married into a Buddhist temple family. When her husband, next in line for the head priest job, got cancer, she went to Buddhist divinity school and got ordained so she could help out her father-in-law. Her husband has been in remission for a long time and the family runs the temple together, sharing various jobs, travelling to parishioners' homes to offer regular memorial services for ancestors etc.

There are some sects which are more austere and rigid, and these are featured on TV from time to time, but the local Buddhist temples seem to be run by families from generation to generation.

Most people in Japan might not describe themselves as Buddhist as they accept Shinto, Christian and Buddhist rites throughout their lives depending on the rite.

Time to get some of these kids to bed.

Hugs,

Believe51 · 07-03-2009, 02:08 PM

.....and me smile too Kathy. I miss you and until you were feeling up to par and back in the saddle again, I just kept you in my prayers and thoughts. It was my pleasure today to pop in and to have heard from you. Keep strong and we will visit more often when you have some energy left (smiling).......looks like you have your hands pretty full recovering and taking care of them little ones......good for you!!!! Talk soon.>>Believe51

ElaineM · 07-04-2009, 11:10 AM

So glad you joined this discussion Kathy. I was waiting for you to explain the way things are in Japan in respect to religion.
The British lady priest should meet one of my friends and co members of one of the interfaith groups here in Hawaii. She was a local elementary school teacher who went to Budhist seminary in Japan after her husband died of cancer. She is now the priest of a local Buddhist temple dedicated to Kannon, the Buddha of compassion and mercy. She wears western clothes outside of the temple and the clothing of a Buddhist priest in the temple. Her children do not want to follow her into the priesthood, so eventually she is going to have to find a successor. I also know a married Celtic Catholic priest in Hawaii. We have a great mix of religions in Hawaii and I am happy to see Japan is so open to many kinds of religious practice.
I see no reason why a priest, monk, nun, minister, rabbi or any other kind of clergy person should be forced to stay single. I think they can do their religious duties well and still have a spouse and children if they wish.
I wish you much success in your current treatment Kathy !!!!!!! I am sending you many positive vibes from Hawaii.

Bill · 07-04-2009, 02:17 PM

Hi Elaine! You know I love you. (yes, this is the right time to cringe, and say, "uh oh") I respectfully disagree with your comment as to wether or not a priest/rabbi/cleric of any sort should be forced to stay single. Being "forced" to stay single is not the way to look at it. One, they took a vow, in most cases, I can't speak for all religions, to remain celibate and devote their lives to serving a higher power, in most cases. (I know Buddhism is different) Two, if they change their minds, or their life circumstances change at some point, they should step down from their positions or leave the religion. You don't go into the game, agree to the rules, and then halfway through try to change them to suit you personally. In my opinion, that's one of the ongoing problems with our society/culture. More and more people see rules and laws as negotiable. If the tenets of a certain religion dictate celibacy, the individual should follow those rules that he/she agreed to, or step down. You don't break the rules or try to change the religion. These "rules" have been in place for many thousands of years. Just my opinion, and peace to you, Elaine.

StephN · 07-04-2009, 03:20 PM

Dear Bill -
I see how you are thinking on this one, and I do not wish to enter a "religious war" - perhaps a mild discussion?

Anyway, have you counted the number of lawsuits for sexual crimes that have been brought against Catholic priests all over this country? Not mention the scandals involving some church leaders in other denominations.

If they can't keep it under their robe and not break the vows, than what is the use of taking the celebacy vow??
And why are the guys who are allowed to be married breaking their vows as well?

Sorry, but people break the rules of life all the time.

Jackie07 · 07-04-2009, 03:33 PM

Bill, allow me to interrupt. You seem to have totally forgotten about the movement that started 500 years ago by Martin Luther. At the time, he had to 'protest' the common practice that had been forced upon the priests in the 11th century. (I was surprised by my reading the entry in the encyclopedia - I always thought that celebacy started with the twelve Disciples.)

Japan has always been a unique country and a mixed culture being right in the middle of the cultural war between the East and the West. More than 2500 years ago, Japan had its first 'cultural reformation' and adoped everything from China - the Japanese custume and all it's 'tradition' as we know today is exact the same thing practised in China during the T'ang Dynasty.

When the West knocked on the door of Japan (as well as China and other Asian countries) with cannons and gun powders, the 'practical' Japanese adopted part of the western cultural and quite successfully mixed it with their own during the Meiji period - including 'imperialism' that encouraged them to attempt to occupy the whole 'East Asia' during World War II. The excuse they used (for their East Asian neighbors that were occupied by force) was that the whole East Asia region needed to bind together so it would be 'prosperous' enough to withstand the invasion of the colonists from the West.

We are seeing the 'war' in the Middle East quite similar to the 'wars' in Asia during the 18th, 19th Century. (At least from the prospectives of some of the occupied [or 'liberated' - depends on who you talk to] regions.)

Uh oh, is politics a forbidden topic here?

We are just chit chatting about 'world history'. My point is: Japan is a very unique country with a unique culture which adopts, modifies different cultures and practices to suit her own purpose. And the 'married priests' are just some reflections of this tradition.

Back to Elaine.

Bill · 07-04-2009, 04:15 PM

Yipes! It's hard to cook mushrooms, grill T-bones, and conduct a religious war all at the same time. I didn't know that the "big guns" would be brought out so quickly. "I will return"

ElaineM · 07-04-2009, 04:19 PM

Opps. I didn't mean to start a religious war or any other kind of war. I am sorry if I offended anyone or everyone. Bill and everybody else is entitled to an opinion. No problem.
I belong to one of the interfaith groups I mentioned. I have met many fine people who are totally devoted to their faiths and their congregations from all walks of life and from many religions, both married and single. I have worked with them on projects to benefit the community. I have also studied with them in an academic setting and taught them when I was a teacher. I have learned much from them that helped me to deepen my own faith. I consider the people in the interfaith group I belong to my friends. i have great respect for them. Some of those people have been the most supportive of me and have helped me the most during the last 10 1/2 years. I also have alot of respect and friendship for all the members of this board.

Joe · 07-04-2009, 04:38 PM

If it helps you, by all means do it !! Christine had 12 years of Catholic school, we are very open to all religious views and are not narrow minded at all.

If your religion gives you comfort or solice, we encourage you to practice it. I am positive that in the end, we all answer to the same higher power

This website has been visited by people from over 100 countries, so I am sure that at one time or another we have hosted a person from every religion on this planet.

But please be tolerant of all religions and views.

Warmest Regards
Joe

Sent via Blackberry from the parking lot of the Golden Calf Cathederal and Casino

Bill · 07-04-2009, 04:44 PM

I have a great deal of respect for all religions. Actually, I am an inter-faith kind of person myself. I am a Christian, but I embrace many of the Buddhist philosophies as well. I will be happy to discuss this further after I flip my steaks and water my garden.

StephN · 07-04-2009, 04:53 PM

Oh, come on Joe - there is only ONE Golden Calf Cathedral and Casino and it is NOT in southern Cal. - tee hee.

Did you hear that in Russia all the Casinos have been closed except for some in only 4 designated "gambling areas" way out in Siberia? Guess not enough tax money was going to the Golden Calf in Moscow, so they had to put the Big Boot down to take complete government control.

Bill - putting the Big Guns away now and just have my little brother's Pop Gun. That OK?

Watering my garden too.