concerns and questions

[Joy]

Hi everyone and Happy Birthday to all the people here having them-there are so many. What a good thing, huh?

I am posting because I'm a little messed up over some stuff. I have a scan tomorrow, the first since starting gemzar/carbo/herceptin. I will see the doc on Monday. So any happy thoughts about this treatment and CT results are greatly appreciated.

In addition to inscanity I have some relationship concerns. As you know I have met the love of my life, for which I am so grateful. He is a worrier like me. He is just starting to express his concerns over us and this disease. I am glad that he is. It is taking a toll on him; in addition to everything else he is trying to handle e.g. primary care of kids, crazy, litigious ex, the economy, finances both personally and for his company. It is a lot.

We have recently broached the topic of cohabitation. This is complicated as he owns a home and I "rent" one from my family. We also have 4 kids between us. Shacking up isn't as easy as it used to be in the 'old days'. I know he is at a crossroads with his mortgage and says that if it is just he and his kids he would sell and move. We talked about finding a new place for all of us. We have also talked about modifying his house to accommodate all of us. All of this is exciting and scary and fun and entails hard work.

Since last night he has expressed a lot of stress over the uncertainty in his life and I am one of those factors. It is scaring him and yet he says he loves me more than anyone before. I feel the same way. So much so that I want the very best for him. I would be willing to walk away if it made him happier. It would suck, but I can't live happily knowing that I am freaking someone out to the point of greater stress. He doesn't want that. But I can't help but wonder if it wouldn't be better for him. He is really down and acting a smidge distant. We want a future together and I want a future period (like all of us). I love him so much and he expressed my feelings exactly whan he said that he feels like he is getting closer to me and letting go at the same time. It is a very odd dynamic in a relationship, but for people like us it makes sense.

I guess my questions are does one just continue to get closer and to hell with the letting go part? Is it healthy to do both? Am I complicating his life? Have I done the wrong thing by getting involved? He says he is not being dragged through this as I often put it, but that he has made choices. I think that some of this is his first time of going through inscanity. Which as we all know is really, really hard. It is hard for me still, but I have had A LOT of practice.

I don't know what to think or what to do and I would love any advice from both men and women. I have read through the "caregivers" section of the site and have shared some things with him. I think he wants support from other guys in the same situation and I am not sure how to direct him. He has been on the "Men Against BC" site and that is about it.

And of course I have my own fears about treatment(s). I am always looking at what to do next. Go back to taxane combinations? Trials for targeted txs and hormonals, vaccines, combining approved targeted txs, SIR spheres (for which I may not qualify as there is a little cirrhosis from past cancer), novalis ( a fantasy thought).

On my weeks off I feel great and friends say they would never know this is all going on by looking. I would like to think that I am healthy in all respects and that I have a long time before it all hits the fan. And that there are many options. Options that may actually work for a long time. But as the number of past treatment grows I wonder realistically if that is all possible.

I know that is a lot to throw at you all. I also know that this is the best, best place to "throw it".

In addition to all of this I have concerns over my dad's health and my mom's well-being. I also would love to move away from my financial dependance on my family, but just don't know what to do with working, kids and treatment. I would also appreciate any creativity on that from those of you who have had to deal with younger children, working, treatment, etc.

Okay, before I ramble any more I will sign off. Suffice it to say that I NEED YOU and I LOVE YOU ALL SO MUCH!

[Rich66]

Talk about a full plate! All I can say is under "normal" circumstances, I have concerns about impact on children when cohabitation ensues, moreso when kids from both sides will be cohabiting as well. I've seen some fallout from this type of thing when someone I know remarried shortly after his first wife died of cancer. Just bringing it up since it can be hard to know how the kids (really) feel about things and how choices might change their future. If there are kids old enough to comment, you might consider giving them an anonymous method to express themselves. Kudos to you for opening up about all this and giving it some thought. Good luck tomorrow!

[yankeebikachic]

You say he now seems a little distant. Did you ever suggest ending it because of your health concerns? Maybe he is not distant because of you, maybe something you said. Maybe other things stress him out and it has nothing to do with you. If it were me, I'd enjoy every moment with him, life is too precious and too short to just sit at home, alone. Kids do complicate things a bit though and they always have to come first. You didn't mention their ages or how you all get along.
I'm only 36 years young and not full of worldly experience but maybe some of the other ladies can offer some advice.
I will be thinking of you tomorrow, I am going for a scan as well at 6:45 am and then getting my results on monday afternoon.
Let's think positive thoughts since we're both in this thing together!
Beth

[jml]

Hi Joy~
I'm sorry I don't have any clever or helpful advice/input to offer, but I did want to send you a note of encouragement & a virtual <<<hug>>>
We definitely live the unusual challenge of living in the moment, yet still want/must be able to live & plan for the rest of our world. I'm just so happy that you've found someone to share your heart,and that inspite of your ~10yr bumpy relationship with this disease, you haven't let it prevent you from opening yourself up to love & companionship.
(I was dx'd @33 & have spent much of the past 61/2 in & out of treatment, not including the 7 surgeries in 2 years. My primary relationship has been with Cancer & in search of NED...I've had a really hard time with the prospect of inviting someone else into this complex, uncertain world& thus far share my life with any amazing family & family of friends and my dog-child, which is pretty wonderful, but can be limiting and a little lonely at times).
You deserve to have someone love you unconditionally & share in your world, however complex, uncertain & scary. He has chosen to walk this path with you & I feel quite certain that he'd rather maneuver the bumps with you than walk his own more predictable path alone.
I'm sure you'll receive much more practicle, applicable advice from other friends here on this site, but I just wanted to send you a note of encouragement.

Keep the Faith~

[Julie2]

Sending all the positive thoughts and prayers for your scan. I am also going for a PET/CT scan tomorrow.

Julie

[chrisy]

Joy, it's big stuff. All of it. I just can't begin to say what I feel about it. I wish we could take a walk out to the end of the street here and look out over Monterey Bay and talk and cry and hug. It really would make it better (I do it regularly)

To me, this paragraph said it all:
[Since last night he has expressed a lot of stress over the uncertainty in his life and I am one of those factors. It is scaring him and yet he says he loves me more than anyone before. I feel the same way. So much so that I want the very best for him. I would be willing to walk away if it made him happier. It would suck, but I can't live happily knowing that I am freaking someone out to the point of greater stress. He doesn't want that. But I can't help but wonder if it wouldn't be better for him. He is really down and acting a smidge distant. We want a future together and I want a future period (like all of us). I love him so much and he expressed my feelings exactly when he said that he feels like he is getting closer to me and letting go at the same time. It is a very odd dynamic in a relationship, but for people like us it makes sense.]

This is the suckiest part about cancer, it tries to steal our dreams and hopes and makes us want to push those who love us away (for their own good) just when we most need to have that love - and they most need to give it.

I have the same feelings from time to time - the difference is that since John and I have been married a while, my thoughts go more towards the "oh I hate that John is STUCK with me in this crappy deal". By the way, John does NOT wish he hadn't married me, but we BOTH would prefer I wasn't living with cancer.

But really Joy, both our situations are that of love holding people together through a horrible life circumstance. How can ANYONE live with it? But you know, we learn to live with it as do those who love us because the alternative is to walk away from the most important things. Cancer is the sucky thing, Love is the awesome thing. Awesome is always stronger than sucky.

See, now I am becoming completely incoherent! Sorry, I'm sure that's not very helpful at all. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it seems you were drawn into this relationship, as was he, by forces stronger than either of you. Don't second guess that, primal forces of the universe are usually right. That doesn't mean it is stress free, or easy (DUH).

One possibly useful suggestion is to try and hook up with Bill. He is so awesome and I'm not just saying that because I am his #1 fan (watch that generate a lot of competition!)

Also, it seems like there are a lot of other things, besides you (you little troublemaker) that are weighing on Luca. Sure, there is uncertainty and fear around your future, but there is also all the GOOD stuff about you. Maybe you are the only thing keeping him sane, and one of the few things that make him want to get up in the morning and face each new day.

OK, now I REALLY need to go walk by the bay. I'm putting on my tennies right now. I'll talk it over with my friend and we'll both wrap you in loving prayers and ask that your worries and burdens be lifted.

Not that it matters, but I love you more than I can even say.

Hugs,
Chris

[Mary Anne in TX]

Joy, I just add my caring thoughts to so many others. Cancer is like the kid in the class that keeps others from hearing and working. It's like the wacky relative that doesn't know when to go home. And sometimes we think that we're the cancer. But we're not!!! We're the person who still wants a good life, loves the people who bring us hope and joy, and needs all that back in return.
You're in one of those gooye (how in the world do you spell that) times that's like trying to run in quick sand! Count minutes and take it a little at a time. You guys will know what to do when you know what to do. Trust yourself girl. You're one smart cookie and you'll solve this together. Lots of prayers for a peaceful day and weekend. ma

[Mary Jo]

Hi Joy........First of all I want to say "hi!" And as always, I receive "Joy" when I see you have posted.

Now to your questions.......First off, I surely don't have the answers but I have opinions and I'll share those.

Like Rich said, I think combining families is tough stuff. It's tough under the best circumstances much less financial and otherwise. I don't know that I think that is a good idea for any of you. If you were to commit to each other through marriage, of course, that would be different (I mean geez, if you actually got married you wouldn't live apart but I don't think I'd do that either) BUT nonetheless, the stress of combining families would still be their. For me personally, raising my kids was tough enough MUCH LESS combining with another family. I don't know that I would have even remarried while still having children at home. But, that's just me. I came from "combined families" and I didn't enjoy it so probably wouldn't have chosen that for my children. Then again, that's easy for me to say as I am not in your shoes. I have a great husband and father and I was never in that situation. So, I'm only giving you an opinion about how I think I'd feel. (boy I'm helpful huh?)

As for your "friends" feelings...well, I can only image how he feels...he loves you. I don't think pulling away is the answer - no - I think you need to sit down and really talk about it all.

I know I wasn't much help Joy.......but I'm doing the best I can here.

Know that I love you and that I care.....sincerely.

Mary Jo

[mts]

Cancer makes me think of life and living.
Perhaps this is an advantage you may have over Luca... any obstacle in a healthy world cannot compare to the obstacles cancer survivors face. No doubt mortgages, kids and jobs are stressful... throw cancer in the mix and the rest is mundane. Its like you have to step down in order to have his concerns and he needs to step up to get to yours.
I used to put more thought into changing the oil in my car than I did about living.
Your relationship is what it is.
It seems you are the nurturer and he seems to be reluctant to take that role "when needed"--- not because he can't or won't, but because he does not know how... he needs to be reassured that its NORMAL to have doubts... We all doubt. Cancer is that fog that permeates itself on everything and everyone near it.
From what I read, your relationship is more open than most people I know. That is a huge plus. He obviously cares very deeply for you !
No one has that elusive crystal ball. Letting go, getting closer, what does that all mean ? YOU ARE HUMAN ! Quality of EMOTIONAL life is as important as the physical life. If when you wake up you look forward to being with this guy, then go for it. Stay with it.
I honestly think that even if you did not have cancer, he would be stressing over some other thing. Heck- we all do.
Try to go back to the time you both met and focus on what drew you two together.
Thats my story and I'm stickin' to it!
xo
maria

[chrisy]

WOW, MA and Maria, you really said it all! Thanks

[CLTann]

Joy, It is a very complex and thorny situation. I will try my best to analyze the situation with a cool head. First of all, the fact that he already expressed a fear and concern in your relationship, it served a clear signal that there is a problem he couldnot resolve. To me, it means that he now has doubt about your future together. I would therefore candidly discuss this serious relationship with honesty and sincerity with him. How about suggesting a trial cooling off period and test whether your love to each other is stronger than you feel? A partner with cancer is always a cloud shielding the real image. He could not clearly speak out his fear lest you would easily misunderstand. By trying a cooling off period, you signal to him that it is entirely a free choice of his making wiether his love for you will conquor all these deep-rooted problems. As to your relationship with your own parents, I would suggest that parental love and concern are limitless and you need their help as much as they are willing to give. At this difficult period, you need them more than ever. Good luck and good test results.

[Faith in Him]

Joy,

I don't have much to say but I think the everyone has given you good advise. What you are going through is very difficult. There is nothing like cancer to put a real stresser in a relationship. But, Luca loves you and that is what is really important. Sure the scans are scary and maybe he feels like he wants to step back. Heck, we all feel that way when dealing with cancer. I wish I could walk away from it. But love always prevails. Hold on to what is good in your relationship.

Regarding moving in, I would think about that after you get the scans and maybe holidays behind you. You will both know what is right. My husband was married before and he has two older children. Somehow we have figured out how to make it work but there are times when it can get a little stressful.

You're strong and have been navigating your way through the cancer world for a every long time. I admire you and have no doubt that you will make the right choice for you.

Hugs,
Tonya

[Jean]

Dear Joy,
My first impression when reading your post was how dear and loving you are. Then my next feeling was why should you or anyone who has been dx. with cancer be denied having another person appreciate you, care for you and love you? Luca knew about your bc history and that did not stop him from wanting to be with you. For those of us who deal with bc, each check up, scan,
follow up, pain, ache, etc. can make us very concerned. Our families are concerned, caring and loving friends are concerned about us. It goes with the dx.

The what if's are the strangest. Joy if cancer has taught me one thing, it is no one knows what is around the next corner. Each day brings new wonders into our world becasue we are now very aware of how important each day is. Before dx. many of us never gave a thought to the serious side of life, that all changed the day we were dx. We realize what is important and what is just a waste of time. I guess what I am aiming at here is...what is important is to live the best life you can. Why should you deny yourself affection and love? Because you have bc? That just doesn't sound correct. Luca will have his days that he will feel out of his depth...and isn't that normal for the situation?

Money issues are important and in these crazy financial times even the experts are not sure what to do. Most people are cutting back and being more careful with their purchases, so it would seem financial sound to combine forces with Luca. I do not know the ages of your children so it is very hard to make a fair statement. But I do know this, children need and must have love and kindness....and I am positve you are providing that to your children. Your children know Luca already and depending on their age...I would go forward providing they are getting along with Luca. I have a girlfriend who has just combined her two children with her boyfreind who has three and with much love all is working well. Kids even in the best situations will cause their parents stress....it is part of life...but I would not let that stop me. Need to know more about how everyone is getting along with Luca and his children. Remember Joy even brother and sisters have their nasty moments.

Joy of course there will be times when he may feel frightened....those of us who are married for years and then recieve the bc dx...have husbands who bolt, so what is the difference here? If men cannot deal with the situation they go....I just don't believe you should stop the realtionship based on scans, fear, when all else is working for the two of you.

Yes, there will be stress that is part of life. Also part of life is love and hope. Joy you are a strong fighter and a beautiful women who has so much love to share.
Go and share it...don't toss him away. Let the man make his own choice....if he cannot deal with your bc he will tell you and at that time you will then deal with it. In the meantime enjoy each other, continue to do all the wonderful and beautiful things you do together.

No one has any answer to this darn disease, only that none of us want it. I would not let bc stand in the way of sharing yourself with someone who cares for you. Trust me if you did not have bc it would be something else, kids, family, money, location, oh there is a long list to stop us from doing things. Cancer has taught me not to let anything stop me.....

Sit down with him and just ask him if he is comfortable at this point in time...if he is...then go with it, ...enjoy each other.

You are my hero Joy!
jean

[Hopeful]

Joy,

I do not have children, so I can't address parenting issues first hand. I do have to echo the comments from others about the effect of altering your living arrangements on both sets of children. There is currently uncertainty in all their lives, and the comfort of what they think of as "home" may be a constant that helps to keep them grounded.

As to your thoughts about complicating his life, well, now is not the time to go getting all co-dependent. He has free will. He is an adult capable of making decisions, running a business and raising two children. This is his call. It sounds to me like the idea of blending families is what is really kicking up a lot of the dust here. FWIW, I know a couple, married, who both have children from their previous marriages. They have decided to keep both of their respective homes (which are about an hour apart) so that their children can continue to live in familiar surroundings, and to also make the shared custody arrangements they have with their ex's work. Not ideal, but they are happy with it, and it seems to be working out. What I am saying I guess is that this may be an element of stress you can take off the table for everyone.

Whatever you do, please know that you are in my thoughts frequently and that I am pulling for you 110%.

Best of luck to you and yours,

Hopeful

[LAURIE]

Joy, what great advice. Talk about free therapy. So many on this site are so articulate. I want to thank you for sharing your concerns so candidly. I have gained a lot of insight on issues I feel about bringing a new child into this world from the posts here. You deserve every love that comes your way. Never deny it. Cancer does not take away our right to be loved. Best to you and everyone in your life.

[Bill]

Hey little Sis! Wow, I've read this thread about three times now and figured it was time to comment. I wish I had some awesome words of wisdom to make everything better for you and Luca, but I don't. To paraphrase the great warrior/king Attila the Hun, "choose your battles carefully. If you choose to fight every battle, however large or small that comes your way, you may not have enough strength or resources to fight the really important ones". Joy, right now your major battle is beating cancer. Please try to set aside worries of dependence on your family, and worries about Luca's dealings with his ex., and all thoughts, at this point of co-habitation. The holidays, as we all know, are extremely stressful all by themselves. You have a "laundry list" of added stresses. Let me help you eliminate one right now. Look Luca and the eye and tell him, "Luca, I love you and want to be with you, but I've got way too much going on right now to discuss moving in together. You can take me out to dinner on January 15th, and we will discuss it then." Joy, by then you will have more info. on your scans, and I'm sure Luca can hang in there another six weeks with his house. The stress of the holidays will be behind you, and I'm sure that whatever help you are receiving from family can continue until then. Also, it seems like Chrisy wants me and you to "hook up", which sounds great, but I'm spoken for and you are too, so that won't work. You hang in there, Sis. I'll PM you with my e-mail address to pass on to Luca if he wants to chat about anything. Love ya, Bill

[jones7676]

I always try to watch for updates on how you are doing. It seems your "plate" is pretty full and extra challenges sure can be difficult.

I've been so glad that you found someone.....I gues I didn't think about how complex it is - but I understand a little about how hard it can be.

Since I've made enough good decisions and mistakes in my life, I won't be offering you any advice.

I think that some of the replies you got sounded good. It is nice to see people that can offer good advice giving it to you.

I just hope that however it works out that is a happy and positive thing for you!

[chrisy]

Bill, I meant hook Luca up with you...although that doesn't sound better. But it seems that you got my drift anyway!

[harrie]

Joy, in response to your consideration of living together, although I don't know the ages of your kids and the situation on how well everyone gets along, something tells me it might be wise to be very cautious of doing so, esp if he is in limbo of being there and letting go. If your kids are secure now with the present arrangements, I would just leave it as such for now.
This time of the year can be so stressful as it is, if possible, I would not recommend trying to make sigificant decisions about your lifestyle arrangements during this holiday season. It can be too high intensity of a time to make these kinds of decisions.
My only advice would be to try to relax and allow him to make whatever decisions he feels will be best and you focus in on what is best for you and your kids today. The amazing part of life is that life has an amazing way of working out for the best. I am a firm believer in that.
You received some great advice from many here. I just added my 2 cents worth and basically to let you know that I care.