fatigue - chemo result... or?

Pam P · 06-23-2008, 02:44 PM

I just started taxol/avastin in early May. taxol 3 wks on; 1 wk off. avastin every other week. I've had 5 taxol tx so far. I've had all the tx on Wednesdays. After the 1st 4 I was wiped out for Wed., thurs, & somewhat on Fri. But this last tx, it's already Monday & all I want to do is sleep. I can't snap out of it. My tumor marker had dropped 2 wks ago when I saw the dr. so I don't suspect anything else going on. Is this normal as far as the taxol regimen continuing to zap more of my energy for longer periods of time as I get more treatments?

chrisy · 06-23-2008, 03:29 PM

Hi Pam,

Never had that particular combo, but I know that when I had Taxol/Carbo/herceptin, the fatigue and whatnot seemed to be cumulative - that is, I got more spacey as it went on.

Everyone responds differently, some people get "used to" the chemo and rebound more quickly, for others it takes longer every time to feel more normal.

My suggestion is to take your cues from your body. If you're tired, rest - and maybe even get more rest than usual on the first day or two, that might help you bounce back faster. You may also be fighting a bug of some sort, as your resistance is down.

hang in there!
chris

jones7676 · 06-23-2008, 07:50 PM

When I had taxol the further I got into treatment the longer the after effects lasted. I had to rest more. Perhaps you could put a hammock or a nice lawn chair outside to rest in so you can still enjoy the great outdoors. Anyway, it sounds pretty normal to me. Get plenty of rest and enjoy the good days!

Pam P · 06-24-2008, 04:55 AM

I guess rest it is. The 1st few weeks I was relieved that I only felt tired a couple of days. Chris & Barb - that wasn't the answer i wanted to hear that it gets worse, but good to know what to expect! Barb, I like your idea of a hammock in the sun.

I'm so tired of being tired. But i know I'm preaching to the choir on that one.

How do you cope? My house is so dusty/dirty/cluttered with so many projects / repairs that are needed & I just don't have the energy. I don't have the $$ to hire it done & no family close by to ask to do it. I'm not at the point yet that I'm ready to ask friends -- that's a hard one for me. I suppose it's a pride thing of asking. I've asked for other help, but to have people come in & see my scary basement for instance I'd be too embarrassed. Stupid, I know.

I never was a neatnik but this too much. I guess the answer is do what I can & let the rest go.

SoCalGal · 06-24-2008, 08:35 AM

Hi Pam-
Tired of being tired - I feel that every day of my life. You have been on chemo for many years. I am on tykerb for a year now and herceptin/avastin/zometa along with it for 6/3/and 2 months respectively. Perhaps your onc wants to add in zometa - it's supposed to be "good" for bone mets. Helps to heal them and also contain them.

Several things I want to say to you...but the single most important thought is very personal. I will try to be concise. When my mom died suddenly in her sleep at age 58 - I was 38 (nearly 15 years ago). It was such a complete shock to me that I was devastated and had to go to therapy. It was during that time that I learned how to ask people for help.

I cannot tell you the many times since then I have said if I hadn't learned how to ask for help I could not have survived this disease for 12 years! You must get comfortable asking for help. ALLOWING people to do for you and be there for you and pitch in with support benefits them as well as you. Think of what you would do for another person and then allow others to give to you. It will help you in ways you cannot imagine.

It is still not easy for me to ask - and many times I have to force myself to just spit the words out - but the support of my friends and family has literally saved my life.

I would suggest that you send an email to a group of friends and be honest with what you need. Another option is to have a friend write the email and organize the help on your behalf. That's okay too! No one cares if your basement is a mess and coming over to clean up is something so easy and tangible that one can do for another.

You've been fighting a long time - no wonder you are tired!

Blessings!
Flori

carstell · 06-24-2008, 11:16 AM

Hey Pam,
I am with the other gals on the cumulative effects. I just finished my #12 Taxol last Friday. I have had to take a nap every day so far.Just exhausted.
On the dirty house note. I was so worried about my house too. I had dust bunnies bigger than my kids. Now is the time to take care of you! The dust and dirt can wait.Financially we are a bit strapped too. I haven't worked since 12/07. I figure we can do without a few of the extra things right now. Just focus on you. No one can fault you for a less that clean house. If they do, thats their problem not yours. Focus on you. The rest will come.
And as Flori said. Let others help. I don't think that is easy for any of us to do. Just know that as you would want to help others in your situation, you should to let them help you!
Cheryl

StephN · 06-24-2008, 11:30 AM

Dear Pam -
I have been at this cancer fight for 8 years now myself. My stamina is not the same and never WILL be.

Fortunately I can afford to have someone come in and do the big cleaning every 4 weeks. This forces me to at least have things up off the floors and the counters somewhat cleared.

My hubby is good at helping me when I tell him what I am trying to do and what my idea is to organize something. Maybe that would be a good approach.

Make a list of 10 Priorities. Think who you know is good at those tasks and ask them to help you with something specific.

If you try to use the "shotgun" approach, all you do is have many frustratingly unfinished projects or tasks and a worse mess than you started with. This has been my experience, and learning (the hard way) to focus on one thing at a time and not get distracted has been my (and my marriage's) salvation!

BonnieR · 06-24-2008, 02:02 PM

Hi Pam.
It has also been my experience that the fatigue is cumulative. And you have endured alot more treatment than I.
I also notice that I have most energy in the morning and have tried to focus my activities then.
I know what you mean about unfinished projects. Interestingly, one of the first things I thought about when diagnosed was all the unfinished business I had put off. Including selling a home full of "stuff." We finally began to tackle that chore last week. I found a good book that helped motivate me. "Its All Too Much" It addresses being able to let go of things and clear out the clutter. That has always been a problem for me. Can you identify things that are disposable and have a charity come and get them? Maybe you could ask a friend to help sort things WITH you. That way you are not asking them to do it FOR you.
Is it possible to pay for a one time cleaning service? Just to feel better about your immediate surroundings. As Steph mentioned earlier, that at least makes me get surfaces clear enough for them to clean.
I'd forget the scary basement for now!
Keep the faith.
Bonnie

Pam P · 06-24-2008, 02:22 PM

Thank you all for your tips on what's worked for you, and encouragement to ask for help. I can ask for a ride, a meal, or something else, but when it comes to asking someone to come & help clean up my dirt - yuck - I get stuck, but will try to work on asking someone to help on a specific task at least & hopefully maybe getting over my issues with it.

BonnieR · 06-24-2008, 02:41 PM

Pam, something else. Do you have stuff from abandoned hobbies and what not? I am an artist and had such an excess of supplies everywhere. Different art friends came over and helped me organize my space and materials and to make a donation pile. One even brought cake!

Bill · 06-24-2008, 04:23 PM

Hi Pam! I'm sorry to hear about your fatigue. When my wife was on Taxol, she suffered from it also. I don't know anything about your diet or eating habits, but it may help if you change things a little. I recommend a book "the Cancer Survival Cookbook", by Donna Weihofen and Christina Marino. It's not the greatest book in the world, but there are some good recipes and good advice for dealing with fatigue, nausea, etc. For fatigue, eat smaller meals more often, and eat the most when you feel the best. My own advice is to abstain from animal protein and fats during the day. Stick with almonds, walnuts, yogurt, fruits and veggies during the day and then have some healthy meat at dinner. I keep a bag or two of frozen cranberries and blueberries in the freezer and once in awhile grab a handful. It's refreshing and healthy. I can't help with the house-cleaning. I have my own issues here, only I have no good excuse. Warm thoughts and prayers, Bill

Pam P · 06-24-2008, 07:45 PM

Bonnie - When I was dx 7 yrs ago I decided to take up painting. I have a couple of relatives who are good artists & I've always thought I should give it a try too. I've been doing water color & pencil, pen drawings. It's been fun - I'm not great, but have done some pieces I really like. Other than painting supplies, I do have other stuff I could clearn out & am going to try to work on it.

Bill - I try to eat fairly healthy, but good reminder to step up the intention of eating well - & timing small meals like you suggested. Summer time is a good time to get lots of fresh produce too. I have been craving more carbs lately though which has been a struggle. Could be the fatigue is triggering it, or maybe the chemo itself - hard to tell. When I was on xeloda I wasn't craving this junk at all - nor was I feeling this fatigue.

Thanks so much.

ElaineM · 06-24-2008, 10:11 PM

Yes. Chemo could be making you tired. Remember we are taking some pretty powerful drugs that can affect all parts of our bodies. Chemo kills good cells as well as cancer cells. That is one of the reasons people get side effects. I guess it is like a war between the good and bad going on in our bodies during chemo.
Bill had some very good ideas about diet in his post. I try to prepare all the healthy food I can before my treatment and put it into little covered dishes in the refrigerator, so when I come home wiped out I only have to throw things into the pot for a few minutes and eat. Otherwise I would probably be too tired to cook and end up eating things that are not healthy. I am still tired the next day, so I make that my day of rest without feeling guilty. I can catch up with the work etc.
after I feel less tired.
To be on the safe side ask your doc why you are tired. He or she might have be able to tell you why. ou may be anemic. Chemo can reduce the red and white blood cells. That can cause anemia. Anemia can make us tired.
Hang in there.

Terri B · 06-25-2008, 06:06 AM

Pam,

I have only finished treatment #4 of a 12 week (weekly) tx of taxol and herceptin. Yep, i feel your exhaustion.

I have my tx on Mondays and i'm pretty wiped until Thursday or Friday. Saturdays are usually great for me. That's when i can get up a do my weekly chores. I try to get as much done as possible because i know for the remainder of the week, i'm not worth poop.